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Marks of Excellence Explained


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Pontiac Pat #81 Posted 08 October 2015 - 06:33 PM

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View PostMaxChaos24, on 08 October 2015 - 08:49 AM, said:

 

The 14 Days is based on the Global Data of all players who have played that tank. 

 

Can you be more specific Max?  We understand that it is 'based on' that data.  We also understand from earlier posts that it is a linear progression rather than a bell curve distribution.  What we don't know is how the 100% mark is set.  The earlier post led us to believe the 100% threshold is set by the single best player's average of the previous 14 days.  If it is not set this way, then how is that 100% threshold calculated?

 

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LoveSymmetraPlz #82 Posted 08 October 2015 - 06:48 PM

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All I want to know is can we or will we ever be able to see the actual number of damage/ assisted damage we need for each mark?

 ( Credit goes to ExaminedGORE )


LOSTVENGENCE96 #83 Posted 08 October 2015 - 06:54 PM

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View PostMini Gaara, on 08 October 2015 - 02:48 PM, said:

All I want to know is can we or will we ever be able to see the actual number of damage/ assisted damage we need for each mark?

Will be able to soon.



rhymeswithN00bs #84 Posted 08 October 2015 - 06:57 PM

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View PostLOSTVENGENCE96, on 08 October 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

Will be able to soon.

 

They never said that. They're adding the player's percentage of the population average for players who haven't earned a mark yet. Not the actually damage + assisted needed.


 

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LOSTVENGENCE96 #85 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:02 PM

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View PostrhymeswithN00bs, on 08 October 2015 - 02:57 PM, said:

 

They never said that. They're adding the player's percentage of the population average for players who haven't earned a mark yet. Not the actually damage + assisted needed.

Misread. My apologies.



rhymeswithN00bs #86 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:06 PM

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View PostPontiac Pat, on 08 October 2015 - 12:33 PM, said:

 

Can you be more specific Max?  We understand that it is 'based on' that data.  We also understand from earlier posts that it is a linear progression rather than a bell curve distribution.  What we don't know is how the 100% mark is set.  The earlier post led us to believe the 100% threshold is set by the single best player's average of the previous 14 days.  If it is not set this way, then how is that 100% threshold calculated?

 

Thanks for the great replies.

 

I'm not sure the whole normal curve versus linear progression thing is ironed out yet. I think Niko might be mistating. Max has mentioned elsewhere that it's an average of the total player base, which seems to imply it's not a linear progression but rather a normal distribution.

 

(Unless I'm misunderstanding these mathy terms :hiding:)


 

XOXO, Noobius Y


Brevokh #87 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:16 PM

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View PostPontiac Pat, on 08 October 2015 - 06:33 PM, said:

 

Can you be more specific Max?  We understand that it is 'based on' that data.  We also understand from earlier posts that it is a linear progression rather than a bell curve distribution.  What we don't know is how the 100% mark is set.  The earlier post led us to believe the 100% threshold is set by the single best player's average of the previous 14 days.  If it is not set this way, then how is that 100% threshold calculated?

 

Thanks for the great replies.

 

they probably take the average damage of all games that come out with a 95% Mastery Badge. 

MaxChaos24 #88 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:45 PM

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View PostrhymeswithN00bs, on 08 October 2015 - 01:57 PM, said:

 

They never said that. They're adding the player's percentage of the population average for players who haven't earned a mark yet. Not the actually damage + assisted needed.

We did say that. It's in the first post: "Players without a Mark on any tank will not be able to see their percentage while they try to earn the first Mark.  This will be changed in a future update to allow all players to view their progress percentage even if they do not currently own a Mark." :harp: (YAY!)

View PostLOSTVENGENCE96, on 08 October 2015 - 02:02 PM, said:

Misread. My apologies.

Didn't misread, you were correct. :honoring:



Pontiac Pat #89 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:46 PM

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I just had a thought on how they may be calculating the 100% threshold.

 

I had been assuming that this was calculated based on the best 'simple' average, but being that they are using an EMA to measure against the standard they just might be using the best EMA to set the standard.  That would explain a lot.

 

Am I on the right track MaxChaos24?


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rhymeswithN00bs #90 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:49 PM

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View PostMaxChaos24, on 08 October 2015 - 01:45 PM, said:

We did say that. It's in the first post: "Players without a Mark on any tank will not be able to see their percentage while they try to earn the first Mark.  This will be changed in a future update to allow all players to view their progress percentage even if they do not currently own a Mark." :harp: (YAY!)

Didn't misread, you were correct. :honoring:

 

You and I are talking about a progress percentage. LostVengence was replying to someone who asked if we will ever get to see an actual number of damage and assisted needed to earn a mark. Are you saying you're adding that? 

 

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MaxChaos24 #91 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:52 PM

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View PostrhymeswithN00bs, on 08 October 2015 - 02:49 PM, said:

 

You and I are talking about a progress percentage. LostVengence was replying to someone who asked if we will ever get to see an actual number of damage and assisted needed to earn a mark. Are you saying you're adding that? 

 

Ah, sorry. I misread it than. You are correct than, there will be no damage/assist damage displayed, just the percentage. My bad. :honoring:

ll SkagPipe ll #92 Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:57 PM

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deleted...wrong info.

 



Pontiac Pat #93 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:14 PM

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View Postll SkagPipe ll, on 08 October 2015 - 11:57 AM, said:

I haven't seen anything to suggest its not using a normal distribution of scores over the preceding 14 days on any given day.

everyday there are new values calculated at 65percentile, 85 percentile, and 95 percentile for every tank based on the preceding 14 days of data.

If your average damage + assist damage in the past 2 weeks, including the match you just played today to see if you got a MOE, is above the average of 65% percent of the players in that tank over the same time period (the past two weeks), you get a MOE.

This was in a prior thread.  Don't ask me to find the post - there's been a lot of ground covered between then and now.  The gist is that it's a lot less resource intensive to store a single number for each player (the EMA) than to store every result of every game every day.


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LoveSymmetraPlz #94 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:15 PM

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View PostMaxChaos24, on 08 October 2015 - 07:52 PM, said:

 

Ah, sorry. I misread it than. You are correct than, there will be no damage/assist damage displayed, just the percentage. My bad. :honoring:

 

Is there any chance of that changing? it would be a lot less stressful for some players ( Me ) if we knew if we were even close to doing the right mount of damage. :P

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rhymeswithN00bs #95 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:20 PM

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View Postll SkagPipe ll, on 08 October 2015 - 01:57 PM, said:

I haven't seen anything to suggest its not using a normal distribution of scores over the preceding 14 days on any given day.

everyday there are new values calculated at 65percentile, 85 percentile, and 95 percentile for every tank based on the preceding 14 days of data.

If your average damage + assist damage in the past 2 weeks, including the match you just played today to see if you got a MOE, is above the average of 65% percent of the players in that tank over the same time period (the past two weeks), you get a MOE. Now we don't know if you can get, instantly, a MOE 2 or MOE 3 if you are playing in the 85 or 95 percentile right off the bat....i.e. Can you skip MOE 1? I'm guessing not but we don't have details.

 

 

It's not your average damage + assisted in the past 14 days. It's using something called an Exponential Moving Average to only store your most recent game. It then compares your EMA to an average of the entire player base's damage and assisted from the most recent 14 days. Every time you play a game your EMA goes up or down, depending on your performance. The EMA is stored forever. You can not play a tank for a year and come back to it and pick up where you left off, but you'll need to play as well as the player base over the last 14 days.

 

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MaxChaos24 #96 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:25 PM

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View PostMini Gaara, on 08 October 2015 - 03:15 PM, said:

 

Is there any chance of that changing? it would be a lot less stressful for some players ( Me ) if we knew if we were even close to doing the right mount of damage. :P

 

The percentage is enough as it makes it very simple and actually gives you the exact % of where you are at.  If you do 3000 damage and assist damage combined in the match and your % go up, then you are doing enough, if it goes down, you're not doing enough. It's that simple. :honoring:

LoveSymmetraPlz #97 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:28 PM

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View PostMaxChaos24, on 08 October 2015 - 08:25 PM, said:

 

The percentage is enough as it makes it very simple and actually gives you the exact % of where you are at.  If you do 3000 damage and assist damage combined in the match and your % go up, then you are doing enough, if it goes down, you're not doing enough. It's that simple. :honoring:

 

That's my issue, the required amount seems to of gone up since yesterday and I am now just losing %, was hoping if there was a way to see the damage needed I would not have to sacrifice any more % to find out I can't compete with the required amount. I suppose I could just wait a week or so to try the tank again though.

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ll SkagPipe ll #98 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:31 PM

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Is the use of EMA just our supposition or has wargaming confirmed? Storing all data isn't that burdensome and I'd expect the raw data would be quite useful to the programmers in ongoing efforts to balance, tweak, and expand the game.  As a programmer, I'd want the raw data and not just a running average, weighted or otherwise.  



rhymeswithN00bs #99 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:38 PM

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View Postll SkagPipe ll, on 08 October 2015 - 02:31 PM, said:

Is the use of EMA just our supposition or has wargaming confirmed? Storing all data isn't that burdensome and I'd expect the raw data would be quite useful to the programmers in ongoing efforts to balance, tweak, and expand the game. As a programmer, I'd want the raw data and not just a running average, weighted or otherwise.
 

 

Max confirmed it in this thread.

 

http://forum-console.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/109478-marks-of-excellence-explained/page__st__20__pid__2162352#entry2162352


 

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ll SkagPipe ll #100 Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:51 PM

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Thanks. Post deleted. I hate misinfo.




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