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Arty Requires Skill


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Ronin Gaidin #21 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:49 PM

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View PostJohn Arrowsmith, on 12 February 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

So would you say the derp on the kv1 is more easy mode than the captured kv1?

 

Absolutely. Maybe not for doing well overall, but derping out some unfortunate schlub who happens to cross in front your gun with a minimum of effort or ability. 

 

View PostSeagullOfEvil, on 12 February 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

Isn’t a arty cannon just a glorified derp gun?

 

Or a Derp gun is a glorfied Arty :trollface:    A Derp gun is just a direct-fire Arty that people can neither dodge nor hide from. Turn corner -bang- dead.  

 


janesta5 #22 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:52 PM

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Nope it doesn't, I made one yesterday and it's a piece of piss to play . Tactics find a good hidy hole  and pleasantly destroy other players who can't do a thing about it.

 

All you have to watch out for is the odd yolo scout, and tbh I have killed more of them than they me. A good tanker has more skill in his/her little finger than an Arty player and you can wrap it up any way you like but it is easy mode...............................:arta:



Bling Bedazzled #23 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:53 PM

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Stupid converation about a “skill” in a video game.

SeagullOfEvil #24 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:55 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 07:49 PM, said:

Or a Derp gun is a glorfied Arty :trollface:    A Derp gun is just a direct-fire Arty that people can neither dodge nor hide from. Turn corner -bang- dead.  

And arty is a class that can one shot people from the back of the map with impunity, like a derp gun people can neither dodge nor hide from it. Try to play aggressively -bang- dead



allhavoc #25 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:57 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 07:36 PM, said:

Arty takes more skill than the arty haters will ever give it credit for. Mostly to minimize the impact that RNG has. 

 

And I speak as a person with no three-marked arty (generally do not play long enough to make that happen), but I do have a few 2-marked (FV3805, all other Tier IX's at one-mark). 

 

If there is anything that takes no skill at all to play, it's Derp guns. 

 

Doing well in tanks like the KV-2 does take a bit of strategy.  You really need to make good decisions to mitigate your tanks weakness, namely the long reload, slow mobility, and unreliable armor.  Watch somebody with 3-marks, you'll see.

 

Arty takes skill, too, sure.  But, from my experience I'd say that RNG & team performance affects artillery more than any other class.  An arty player could make all the right decisions, but RNG decides whether or not they get hits.  


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John Arrowsmith #26 Posted 12 February 2018 - 07:58 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 07:49 PM, said:

 

Absolutely. Maybe not for doing well overall, but derping out some unfortunate schlub who happens to cross in front your gun with a minimum of effort or ability. 

 

 

Or a Derp gun is a glorfied Arty :trollface:    A Derp gun is just a direct-fire Arty that people can neither dodge nor hide from. Turn corner -bang- dead.  

I don't agree.   Get a kv1 equipped with derp and a    cap kv1 complete with full apcr.   Click rb on both and see which wins.


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N333DL3 #27 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:07 PM

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View Postjanesta5, on 12 February 2018 - 07:52 PM, said:

Nope it doesn't.....

 

A good tanker has more skill in his/her little finger than an Arty player and you can wrap it up any way you like but it is easy 

View PostBling Bedazzled, on 12 February 2018 - 07:53 PM, said:

Stupid converation about a “skill” in a video game.

 

 

So say the guys without any 3-marked tanks.

 

Actually, only one guy with a 3-marked Arty spoke up and he says it takes skill to do.

 

A lot of negative opinion here from folks who don’t seem qualified.  

 

If arty is so easy to play, then let’s see you 3-Mark one and get back to me



MoodyDale #28 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:19 PM

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Mostly luck which I don't have much of.  Most damage I cause in it is splash damage which isn't much or once in a blue moon actually hit something.  Only tank that is OP is the Sexton 1 US.  And after the tier 10 T92 I don't dare waste time in another arty line.  

Ronin Gaidin #29 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:24 PM

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View PostBling Bedazzled, on 12 February 2018 - 02:53 PM, said:

Stupid conversation about a “skill” in a video game.

 

This is very true. I'm pretty sure we are all sitting on our respective couches/chairs/whatever pushing buttons regardless of what tank or class we play.

 

View PostSeagullOfEvil, on 12 February 2018 - 02:55 PM, said:

And arty is a class that can one shot people from the back of the map with impunity, like a derp gun people can neither dodge nor hide from it. Try to play aggressively -bang- dead

 

It's that whole "can't shoot back right away" thing that bothers most people. But by staying on the move and using terrain features or other cover you can make it very difficult on Arty to get a clean shot at you. Or you can turn a corner and have a camping Deathstar or KV-2 send you back to the garage with no chance take any kind of action except die. 

 

View PostJohn Arrowsmith, on 12 February 2018 - 02:58 PM, said:

I don't agree.   Get a kv1 equipped with derp and a    cap kv1 complete with full apcr.   Click rb on both and see which wins.

 

If the KV-2 penetrates, the CKV-1 instantly dies. If it doesn't penetrate, the CKV-1 is merely crippled and near death. The key would be for the CKV-1 to get the KV-2 to miss (using maneuvering, cover, a crafty head fake, arguably "skill"  .  ) and then trying to tear him apart before he can reload. It will take 8 penetrations to kill the KV-2 which the CKV-1 can dish out in a litle over 18 seconds (no equipment). 24 seconds to reload that Derp.....   assuming no misses or bounced shots, and that the first shot on a splash didn't kill his commander/loader/gunner or damage/destroy his gun, the CKV then wins. Also assumes that the KV-2 has no allies anywhere nearby or in firing range. Or for a bit of irony for this thread, assuming the KV-2 doesn't have an allied Arty that takes out the CKV and saves his team mate. 

 

I am always a bit surprised by people that take issue with arty yet love their Derp guns. I know I have games ruined far more often by some point-blank Derp (or some ridiculous Alpha TD like a Jp. E100 ripping you for north of 1,000 hp while ignoring your armor entirely) than I ever get wrecked by arty. 

 

View Postallhavoc, on 12 February 2018 - 02:57 PM, said:

 

Doing well in tanks like the KV-2 does take a bit of strategy.  You really need to make good decisions to mitigate your tanks weakness, namely the long reload, slow mobility, and unreliable armor.  Watch somebody with 3-marks, you'll see.

 

Arty takes skill, too, sure.  But, from my experience I'd say that RNG & team performance affects artillery more than any other class.  An arty player could make all the right decisions, but RNG decides whether or not they get hits.  

 

Long reload, slow mobility, unreliable (or non-existent) armor.....   sounds like Arty to me. I would agree that Arty if far more team dependent - the most materful arty player in the world can't fight getting rushed by fast-movers. And if RNG decides you aren't hitting anything this game, then you aren't hitting anything this game. 

Edited by Ronin Gaidin, 12 February 2018 - 08:25 PM.


II NO x VICE II #30 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:27 PM

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"In general": Arty is easy to play and do reasonably well in. At the same time, Arty is fairly hard to be consistent in or 2-3 mark it. I say this as I have many tanks with at least one mark, three with two and I am fairly certain it is easy for me to two mark even the ARL v39, if I wanted to. I do not think I could single mark any Arty, even though it is easy for me to play it and grind XP and advance.

 

As for "3 mark it and then we will see", the retort will likely be - I don't want to or I don't have the patience or I am done with taking so many baths during the day (or pick any reason).

 

Arty is probably a hard class to consistently excel in simply because it is a high RnG, near-zero defense, full offense-mode vehicle.



SeagullOfEvil #31 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:36 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 08:24 PM, said:

It's that whole "can't shoot back right away" thing that bothers most people. But by staying on the move and using terrain features or other cover you can make it very difficult on Arty to get a clean shot at you.

 

You say that but the countless times I’ve been going full speed or using cover or using terrain features and still get clicked on by a arty for most of my health say otherwise. Or maybe I’m just unlucky since the PS4 Arty community hates me, 8 out of 10 games arty will be all over me for the majority of the game.



II NO x VICE II #32 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:36 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 03:24 PM, said:

 

This is very true. I'm pretty sure we are all sitting on our respective couches/chairs/whatever pushing buttons regardless of what tank or class we play.

 

 

It's that whole "can't shoot back right away" thing that bothers most people. But by staying on the move and using terrain features or other cover you can make it very difficult on Arty to get a clean shot at you. Or you can turn a corner and have a camping Deathstar or KV-2 send you back to the garage with no chance take any kind of action except die. 

 

 

If the KV-2 penetrates, the CKV-1 instantly dies. If it doesn't penetrate, the CKV-1 is merely crippled and near death. The key would be for the CKV-1 to get the KV-2 to miss (using maneuvering, cover, a crafty head fake, arguably "skill"  .  ) and then trying to tear him apart before he can reload. It will take 8 penetrations to kill the KV-2 which the CKV-1 can dish out in a litle over 18 seconds (no equipment). 24 seconds to reload that Derp.....   assuming no misses or bounced shots, and that the first shot on a splash didn't kill his commander/loader/gunner or damage/destroy his gun, the CKV then wins. Also assumes that the KV-2 has no allies anywhere nearby or in firing range. Or for a bit of irony for this thread, assuming the KV-2 doesn't have an allied Arty that takes out the CKV and saves his team mate

 

I am always a bit surprised by people that take issue with arty yet love their Derp guns. I know I have games ruined far more often by some point-blank Derp (or some ridiculous Alpha TD like a Jp. E100 ripping you for north of 1,000 hp while ignoring your armor entirely) than I ever get wrecked by arty. 

 

 

Long reload, slow mobility, unreliable (or non-existent) armor.....   sounds like Arty to me. I would agree that Arty if far more team dependent - the most materful arty player in the world can't fight getting rushed by fast-movers. And if RNG decides you aren't hitting anything this game, then you aren't hitting anything this game. 

 

+1 .. agree with the premise.

 

Also for the highlighted comment - I have seen fair share of videos from good players showing medals and what not in their good plays, but failing to mention their opponents are already softened by Arty before they are taken out for said medals/achievements/damage etc. Not to mention, the same players return to the forums to beat their chest about and berate Arty.

 

Of course, this is not the norm, but I do notice it when I see it.



II NO x VICE II #33 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:39 PM

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View PostSeagullOfEvil, on 12 February 2018 - 03:36 PM, said:

 

You say that but the countless times I’ve been going full speed or using cover or using terrain features and still get clicked on by a arty for most of my health say otherwise. Or maybe I’m just unlucky since the PS4 Arty community hates me, 8 out of 10 games arty will be all over me for the majority of the game.

 

You have died about 5,760 times on your PS4. How many of these were Arty shells?



SeagullOfEvil #34 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:46 PM

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View PostII NO x VICE II, on 12 February 2018 - 08:39 PM, said:

 

You have died about 5,760 times on your PS4. How many of these were Arty shells?

 

Want to direct me to a site where I can give you an actual answer? Or do you want me to give a very rough guess (since ive obviously been counting the exact amount of times I’ve died to arty since release) so you can go on tell me how wrong and ret*rded I am?

 

If you really want me to guess I’d say between 750 to 1250



John Arrowsmith #35 Posted 12 February 2018 - 08:48 PM

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View PostRonin Gaidin, on 12 February 2018 - 08:24 PM, said:

 

This is very true. I'm pretty sure we are all sitting on our respective couches/chairs/whatever pushing buttons regardless of what tank or class we play.

 

 

It's that whole "can't shoot back right away" thing that bothers most people. But by staying on the move and using terrain features or other cover you can make it very difficult on Arty to get a clean shot at you. Or you can turn a corner and have a camping Deathstar or KV-2 send you back to the garage with no chance take any kind of action except die. 

 

 

If the KV-2 penetrates, the CKV-1 instantly dies. If it doesn't penetrate, the CKV-1 is merely crippled and near death. The key would be for the CKV-1 to get the KV-2 to miss (using maneuvering, cover, a crafty head fake, arguably "skill"  .  ) and then trying to tear him apart before he can reload. It will take 8 penetrations to kill the KV-2 which the CKV-1 can dish out in a litle over 18 seconds (no equipment). 24 seconds to reload that Derp.....   assuming no misses or bounced shots, and that the first shot on a splash didn't kill his commander/loader/gunner or damage/destroy his gun, the CKV then wins. Also assumes that the KV-2 has no allies anywhere nearby or in firing range. Or for a bit of irony for this thread, assuming the KV-2 doesn't have an allied Arty that takes out the CKV and saves his team mate. 

 

I am always a bit surprised by people that take issue with arty yet love their Derp guns. I know I have games ruined far more often by some point-blank Derp (or some ridiculous Alpha TD like a Jp. E100 ripping you for north of 1,000 hp while ignoring your armor entirely) than I ever get wrecked by arty. 

 

 

Long reload, slow mobility, unreliable (or non-existent) armor.....   sounds like Arty to me. I would agree that Arty if far more team dependent - the most materful arty player in the world can't fight getting rushed by fast-movers. And if RNG decides you aren't hitting anything this game, then you aren't hitting anything this game. 

 

I didn't mention a kv2 though did I.    I also didn't mention  anything about a non-existent kv2 having an arty friend.   This was about which is more easy mode,  I'm pretty sure your argument is not that simple.   Yes derp guns can dish out some dmg almost guaranteed,    but doing 50 dmg by splashing isn't exacty helpful when you have a longer reload.  

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Hobbit Rampage #36 Posted 12 February 2018 - 09:03 PM

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View PostN333DL3, on 12 February 2018 - 06:35 PM, said:

Everyone is familiar with arty rants on these boards, they usually call for nerfing or removal of the class, followed by categorical insults about arty players, lastly the contention that arty “requires no skill”

 

IMO, playing Arty well requires plenty of skill, just not the type of brawling skills that some think defines this game.  Doing successfully is quite a bit more than just clicking.  

 

The only ones who can say for sure are those who’ve gotten a 3-mark on an arty tank.  I’ve never even come close.

 

So with this thread, I invite anyone with a 3-marked (or even 2) Arty to tell us whether it is purely luck or if skill is needed.

 

I agree.  (I havn't played the US line.)  As the game is now the situation is made difficult most  maps that are highly unfavourable to arty, and that most arty were reduced in effectiveness by updates.    Most maps offer few firing locations.  The new tier X lights make the situation worse. 

Juke Ninja #37 Posted 12 February 2018 - 09:11 PM

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Biggest factorz in MoE for Arty...

How long the Match lasts...

How long you stay alive n able to fire...

How Hot your dice are...

How many ProArty posts you made on the forums,

 Posting such Videos like Arty One-Shots will get you Yolo-Listed...



SteelTiiTan #38 Posted 12 February 2018 - 09:15 PM

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View PostN333DL3, on 12 February 2018 - 08:07 PM, said:

If arty is so easy to play, then let’s see you 3-Mark one and get back to me

 

RNG based 3 marks. There's a select amount of things arty players can do to make themselves better than other arty players, everything else is just luck of the draw and 3 marking is getting lucky on maps and RNG that's all. 



F4ST-D3V1LS #39 Posted 12 February 2018 - 09:15 PM

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Arty does require "some" skill.
Leading shots, calculate reloads, positioning etc.
Everybody can be a clicker but there aren't much truly "good" clickers.
Saw some 3 marked m53/55's but i guess cola played a huge role in that.

Let's just say that "normal" tanks require more skill to do well in to keep it civil.


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View PostSeagullOfEvil, on 12 February 2018 - 03:46 PM, said:

 

Want to direct me to a site where I can give you an actual answer? Or do you want me to give a very rough guess (since ive obviously been counting the exact amount of times I’ve died to arty since release) so you can go on tell me how wrong and ret*rded I am?

 

If you really want me to guess I’d say between 750 to 1250

 

You (to any player, not you specifically) are likely die of other causes far more than Arty - but it is only your frustration (read: subjectivity) that makes Arty the more memorable for you over other factors, and more of a hate magnet than it actually is. The numbers do not lie, which is why I posted my query. Arty is not a real issue mostly. Sometimes it is, but those instances are few and far between - far far fewer and far far between other reasons.

 

I used to think too that Arty is ruining my day, but then I started paying more attention (or counting my own mistakes) for a few days and it turns out Arty is hardly an influence on my stats or how I die etc. It just seemed that way to me since it was not being thought of objectively. It is also easy to make it a scapegoat (or blame that class) since everyone else is indulging in the same.

 

Once I one shot a T25/2 in my M12. I instinctively knew that rage mail was imminent so I recorded the last 30s. Well, the exchange did happen and as part of the exchange I sent the video to the player to show him what he was doing wrong - I could predict where would be in a few seconds since he was dutifully following the cobblestone pathway and my aim meant the shell went in through his side. Needless to say, the bitter taste might've still been there but he/she was less animated after seeing it.

 

And here is a more recent exchange:

Spoiler

 

I am not an Arty player per se and will not defend a broken class, but I see this a lot.






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