Jump to content


Developer Idiocy Killed My Favorite Tank. Yours Might Be Next

Maus Nerf 4.6 Balance PAINGOD

  • Please log in to reply
101 replies to this topic

LacqueredBacon #21 Posted 06 September 2018 - 12:02 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 34913 battles
  • 6,159
  • Member since:
    02-02-2015

The incompetence is staggering.  They are surprised that one of the slowest tanks with the best armor and the most hit points have the best survival rate.  Could it be that half the time, the battle is half over by the time the Maus gets to the battle?  And then the tanks it sees are on half health.


 

There is no evidence AT ALL that the devs have any clue what they are doing when it comes to understanding their own game.


 


 



 


BigHundy #22 Posted 06 September 2018 - 12:11 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 9707 battles
  • 3,884
  • [FCCM]
  • Member since:
    12-27-2016

This nerf was unnecessary and I agree with your original post.

But it didn't make the tank useless.

 

The 30B nerf made the tank completely unplayable IMO.


I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol, and cheap women. The other half I wasted -  W.C. Fields

 

On the last day of your life, don't forget to die.

 


Tempest fox3 #23 Posted 06 September 2018 - 12:57 PM

    Major

  • Beta Tester
  • 20951 battles
  • 18,193
  • [JOCO]
  • Member since:
    08-22-2013

View PostBigHundy, on 06 September 2018 - 12:11 PM, said:

This nerf was unnecessary and I agree with your original post.

But it didn't make the tank useless.

 

The 30B nerf made the tank completely unplayable IMO.

 

When I see a maus and any other tank backing it up, I pretty much ignore the maus until its back up is dead and the maus is the only thing left to shoot.

 

 


War is a Democracy and the enemy always gets a vote.

3 MoE's: E-25, M41 Walker Bulldog, E-50, Snakebite, E-75, T32, Tiger 131 - In order obtained

 

Spoiler

BigHundy #24 Posted 06 September 2018 - 01:19 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 9707 battles
  • 3,884
  • [FCCM]
  • Member since:
    12-27-2016

View PostTempest fox3, on 06 September 2018 - 12:57 PM, said:

 

When I see a maus and any other tank backing it up, I pretty much ignore the maus until its back up is dead and the maus is the only thing left to shoot.

 

 

 

In a good spot I believe the Maus can still be an effective wall for it's team.

The armour is still really strong when properly angled.

I agreed the gun nerf was unnecessary but really the main purpose of the tank is to block corridors etc

 

As I've said before, my biggest issues with the balancing aren't really what they did, but what they DIDN'T do.

I can live with the nerfs to a lot of these tanks, but the blatantly OP tanks that were untouched is the real crime here.


Edited by BigHundy, 06 September 2018 - 01:20 PM.

I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol, and cheap women. The other half I wasted -  W.C. Fields

 

On the last day of your life, don't forget to die.

 


Tempest fox3 #25 Posted 06 September 2018 - 01:25 PM

    Major

  • Beta Tester
  • 20951 battles
  • 18,193
  • [JOCO]
  • Member since:
    08-22-2013

View PostBigHundy, on 06 September 2018 - 01:19 PM, said:

 

In a good spot I believe the Maus can still be an effective wall for it's team.

The armour is still really strong when properly angled.

I agreed the gun nerf was unnecessary but really the main purpose of the tank is to block corridors etc

 

As I've said before, my biggest issues with the balancing aren't really what they did, but what they DIDN'T do.

I can live with the nerfs to a lot of these tanks, but the blatantly OP tanks that were untouched is the real crime here.

 

My point is that you can just ignore it, its lack of mobility and damage output make it not a threat.

 

Kill all his back up and then collect all the free damage on the maus when he's alone.


War is a Democracy and the enemy always gets a vote.

3 MoE's: E-25, M41 Walker Bulldog, E-50, Snakebite, E-75, T32, Tiger 131 - In order obtained

 

Spoiler

BigHundy #26 Posted 06 September 2018 - 01:29 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 9707 battles
  • 3,884
  • [FCCM]
  • Member since:
    12-27-2016

View PostTempest fox3, on 06 September 2018 - 01:25 PM, said:

 

My point is that you can just ignore it, its lack of mobility and damage output make it not a threat.

 

Kill all his back up and then collect all the free damage on the maus when he's alone.

 

To be honest you might be right, I rarely even see them in battle.

So might just be another case of good players propping up a balanced tank, making sure it was nerfed.

Oh well.

 

My point still stands, they ignored far too many OP tanks.


I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol, and cheap women. The other half I wasted -  W.C. Fields

 

On the last day of your life, don't forget to die.

 


TocFanKe4 #27 Posted 06 September 2018 - 02:49 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 20984 battles
  • 24,350
  • [GIRLS]
  • Member since:
    03-16-2014
It's top armor and survivability.....let's nerf the gun!  :facepalm:  If it's overpowered in armor and survivability, don't you think that might have been what needed a nerf, not the gun stats?

 

The E25 was built for Shenanigans


scwirpeo #28 Posted 06 September 2018 - 04:49 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 40633 battles
  • 11,165
  • [CRY]
  • Member since:
    02-14-2014

View PostTocFanKe4, on 06 September 2018 - 07:49 AM, said:

It's top armor and survivability.....let's nerf the gun! :facepalm: If it's overpowered in armor and survivability, don't you think that might have been what needed a nerf, not the gun stats?

 

Yea that earth shattering 52% win rate. I would sell a tank over garbage stats like that. This is why yellows shouldn't be using win % to pick what tanks need balance. They are ignorant of why the tank has that win rate, then jump to conclusions.

MOEs so I can pretend like they matter

Spoiler

 


Zxyphos #29 Posted 06 September 2018 - 04:57 PM

    Major

  • Beta Tester
  • 18182 battles
  • 12,368
  • [RATT]
  • Member since:
    10-15-2013
What I don't understand is that the Maus was just recently buffed, buff now it is being nerfed again? I just think that if more time and effort went into actually trying to balance things right the first time, less time and effort would have to go into all these buffs and nerfs. 

FusionStar287 #30 Posted 06 September 2018 - 05:33 PM

    Major

  • WoTC Ambassador
  • 20400 battles
  • 16,426
  • [JOCO]
  • Member since:
    08-13-2013

View PostLord Quijote, on 06 September 2018 - 01:20 AM, said:

 

I disagree. If the Maus has been more effective as a wall then before, it's because other tanks have had their penetration/alpha values nerfed. Compromising the gun just makes the Maus a rolling target with no capacity to return fire. 

 

The armor was adequate before, if not outstanding. The minor buffs it received have just made gold spam more prevalent than ever. 

 

It's no better than it was, survival wise. If anything, players are more reluctant to shoot at it than before, but you can't really call that a buff. 

I have to disagree with your disagreement. Even before it was buffed the Maus made an exceptional wall, and it was almost entirely because of its armor and health. After it was buffed, and now nerfed, it still has better armor and gun handling than it did originally, which still allows it to be a very effective wall. Also, to be honest the Maus' gun has never really mattered much. Its alpha damage is nice for punishing enemy players who aren't paying attention or have just fired, but for the most part the Maus wins games by distracting reds and bouncing their shots so that your team can take them apart safely. In that regard the Maus was barely nerfed, if at all, and as a whole has only been buffed.

 

Of course, I still feel that, like many of the supposed balance changes in 4.6, the Maus nerfs were both unnecessary and a poor change, but I still feel like the Maus is more than capable in its intended/best role.


"My dear brothers, take note of this: Men should be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to become angry, for man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires." ~ James 1: 19-20

 

"wefWEGFRF" - RaiBOT01, 2017


Pit Friend #31 Posted 06 September 2018 - 10:57 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 33350 battles
  • 18,445
  • [PTATO]
  • Member since:
    07-14-2014

The thing I want to know is, how can they say the Maus had the “Top damage per shot”? It had pretty much the worst DPM of any tier X. Could it have been scoring higher both because the tank wasn’t played much and when it was it didn’t fire all that often due to its slow speed and low rate of fire?

 

Is this yet another case of a tank not being played that much skewing the paper stats?


When the nice guy loses his patience the devil shivers. 


Promised_DeathYT #32 Posted 07 September 2018 - 12:01 AM

    First lieutenant

  • Players
  • 19503 battles
  • 507
  • [VETZ]
  • Member since:
    12-06-2015

View PostJohn Arrowsmith, on 06 September 2018 - 09:54 PM, said:

"Top dmg blocked"   

 

On a Heavy tank,  that's just unacceptable,  let's nerf the crap out of it.  

 

Spoiler

 

 

Let's make the waffle great again and give it the original stats back ....as I dont feel like its balanced enough 


Current Tier X

T110E5,T110E3,T57 Heavy,Leopard 1,E100,IS7,TVPT50/51,T92,FV4005,WafflePnz,OBJ430,   OBJ277, WZ11115A

 


TocFanKe4 #33 Posted 07 September 2018 - 12:42 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 20984 battles
  • 24,350
  • [GIRLS]
  • Member since:
    03-16-2014

View PostPit Friend, on 06 September 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

The thing I want to know is, how can they say the Maus had the “Top damage per shot”? It had pretty much the worst DPM of any tier X. Could it have been scoring higher both because the tank wasn’t played much and when it was it didn’t fire all that often due to its slow speed and low rate of fire?

 

Is this yet another case of a tank not being played that much skewing the paper stats?

 

If a T54 takes 6 shots with its DPM ,misses a couple  because of snap shots, but pens the rest, it has 213 damage per shot with 1280 damage.  But if a Maus takes 3 shots from point blank in that same time, bounces or misses one, it gets 326 damage per shot and 980 damage.  Which tank did more for the team? 

 

Both tanks missed or bounced a third of their shots.  But somehow using this flawed statistic the Maus gets nerfed because it's doing way more damage per shot.  

 

The fact they're relying on damage per shot to balance their game make me realize they're not doing a good job.  They need to stop looking at damage per shot completely.  There's too many things that go into it such as combat distance , pen of the gun , reload and tank accuracy. 

 

An incredibly OP tank with a really fast firing gun can have low damage per shot ,but be extremely overpowered.  A tank with a slow firing gun and great accuracy/pen will look OP in this stat, even though it doesn't do much damage overall.  

 

WG , please quit using damage per shot to balance tanks.  It makes you do really dumb things.


 

The E25 was built for Shenanigans


scwirpeo #34 Posted 07 September 2018 - 12:48 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 40633 battles
  • 11,165
  • [CRY]
  • Member since:
    02-14-2014

View PostTocFanKe4, on 06 September 2018 - 05:42 PM, said:

 

If a T54 takes 6 shots with its DPM ,misses a couple  because of snap shots, but pens the rest, it has 213 damage per shot with 1280 damage.  But if a Maus takes 3 shots from point blank in that same time, bounces or misses one, it gets 326 damage per shot and 980 damage.  Which tank did more for the team? 

 

Both tanks missed or bounced a third of their shots.  But somehow using this flawed statistic the Maus gets nerfed because it's doing way more damage per shot.  

 

The fact they're relying on damage per shot to balance their game make me realize they're not doing a good job.  They need to stop looking at damage per shot completely.  There's too many things that go into it such as combat distance , pen of the gun , reload and tank accuracy. 

 

An incredibly OP tank with a really fast firing gun can have low damage per shot ,but be extremely overpowered.  A tank with a slow firing gun and great accuracy/pen will look OP in this stat, even though it doesn't do much damage overall.  

 

WG , please quit using damage per shot to balance tanks.  It makes you do really dumb things.

 

They will use it to Nerf the maus but not the 183.:B Dynamic.


MOEs so I can pretend like they matter

Spoiler

 


TocFanKe4 #35 Posted 07 September 2018 - 12:53 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 20984 battles
  • 24,350
  • [GIRLS]
  • Member since:
    03-16-2014

View Postscwirpeo, on 06 September 2018 - 07:48 PM, said:

 

They will use it to Nerf the maus but not the 183.:B Dynamic.

 

But 183 is taking 2 shots , missing 1, and splashing for 600.  The 183 then dies.  300 damage per shot ,which is less than Maus.  Maus still nerfed.  There's enough players doing that in the game because the 183 is very heavily played.  Those same average tomato players will live long enough in a Maus to get to the fight late ,take three point blank shots then die.  


 

The E25 was built for Shenanigans


scwirpeo #36 Posted 07 September 2018 - 01:03 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 40633 battles
  • 11,165
  • [CRY]
  • Member since:
    02-14-2014

View PostTocFanKe4, on 06 September 2018 - 05:53 PM, said:

 

But 183 is taking 2 shots , missing 1, and splashing for 600.  The 183 then dies.  300 damage per shot ,which is less than Maus.  Maus still nerfed.  There's enough players doing that in the game because the 183 is very heavily played.  Those same average tomato players will live long enough in a Maus to get to the fight late ,take three point blank shots then die.  

 

The 183 has the second highest damage per shot among TDs according to pains stats at over 700. The tank beating it is probably the poop barn. It misses and hits for 600. The maus misses and hits zero, like a balanced tank should.

MOEs so I can pretend like they matter

Spoiler

 


Pit Friend #37 Posted 07 September 2018 - 01:04 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 33350 battles
  • 18,445
  • [PTATO]
  • Member since:
    07-14-2014

View Postscwirpeo, on 06 September 2018 - 07:48 PM, said:

 

They will use it to Nerf the maus but not the 183.:B Dynamic.

It’s probably because the 183 doesnt always do its massive damage with penetrating hits. They probably only are comparing penetrating hits as that’s how most tanks have to have to do damage. So all the 800 point non-penetrating hits to the tracks aren’t being counted.

 

I fully expect the Deathstar to be buffed yet again in the next balance patch for “reasons”,


When the nice guy loses his patience the devil shivers. 


TocFanKe4 #38 Posted 07 September 2018 - 01:05 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 20984 battles
  • 24,350
  • [GIRLS]
  • Member since:
    03-16-2014

View Postscwirpeo, on 06 September 2018 - 08:03 PM, said:

 

The 183 has the second highest damage per shot among TDs according to pains stats at over 700. The tank beating it is probably the poop barn. It misses and hits for 600. The maus misses and hits zero, like a balanced tank should.

 

It's not the highest, though ,so of course no nerf :trollface:


 

The E25 was built for Shenanigans


scwirpeo #39 Posted 07 September 2018 - 01:13 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 40633 battles
  • 11,165
  • [CRY]
  • Member since:
    02-14-2014

View PostPit Friend, on 06 September 2018 - 06:04 PM, said:

It’s probably because the 183 doesnt always do its massive damage with penetrating hits. They probably only are comparing penetrating hits as that’s how most tanks have to have to do damage. So all the 800 point non-penetrating hits to the tracks aren’t being counted.

 

I fully expect the Deathstar to be buffed yet again in the next balance patch for “reasons”,

 

I love that the Type-5 is hitting too hard at 381 27% of it's 1400 potential, but the 183 hits 792 out of it's potential 1750 45% damage per hit. Seems rather biased to me.

MOEs so I can pretend like they matter

Spoiler

 


Lord Quijote #40 Posted 07 September 2018 - 06:44 PM

    Staff sergeant

  • Players
  • 51 battles
  • 360
  • Member since:
    10-10-2016

View PostFusionStar287, on 06 September 2018 - 05:33 PM, said:

I have to disagree with your disagreement. Even before it was buffed the Maus made an exceptional wall, and it was almost entirely because of its armor and health. After it was buffed, and now nerfed, it still has better armor and gun handling than it did originally, which still allows it to be a very effective wall. Also, to be honest the Maus' gun has never really mattered much. Its alpha damage is nice for punishing enemy players who aren't paying attention or have just fired, but for the most part the Maus wins games by distracting reds and bouncing their shots so that your team can take them apart safely. In that regard the Maus was barely nerfed, if at all, and as a whole has only been buffed.

 

Of course, I still feel that, like many of the supposed balance changes in 4.6, the Maus nerfs were both unnecessary and a poor change, but I still feel like the Maus is more than capable in its intended/best role.

 

I don't believe the Maus is meant to be played as a pure wall, nor do I play it like that. In my view it's a very solid brawling tank that can absorb lots of shells and then return fire with solid accuracy and alpha.

 

If you take into account that damage blocked does not factor into credits or XP, it's clear that soaking up hits is not enough in the Maus. You need to be blocking and dealing around 3K per match in order to be a good Maus player. And at this point, expecting your teammates to do anything for you (like hit the tanks that are wasting their shells on you) is a major stretch. Most greens see the Maus and think "oh it doesn't need any help", and then call you a bum when you get surrounded and melted by the enemy team.


Edited by Lord Quijote, 07 September 2018 - 06:45 PM.

come and get them





Also tagged with Maus, Nerf, 4.6, Balance, PAINGOD

1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users