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MM and Motivation

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Poll: MM and motivation (53 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 5 battles in order to participate this poll.

Do you like the current MM

  1. Yes (11 votes [20.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.75%

  2. No (42 votes [79.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 79.25%

Would you pay more for better MM

  1. Yes (15 votes [27.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 27.78%

  2. No (34 votes [62.96%])

    Percentage of vote: 62.96%

  3. Fine as is (5 votes [9.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.26%

Premium tanks go +- 1 tier MM

  1. Yes (35 votes [66.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 66.04%

  2. No (18 votes [33.96%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.96%

Would you play more if the MM changes did get a longer quoe time

  1. Yes (32 votes [60.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.38%

  2. No (21 votes [39.62%])

    Percentage of vote: 39.62%

Do you like the current light meta

  1. Yes (20 votes [37.74%])

    Percentage of vote: 37.74%

  2. No (33 votes [62.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 62.26%

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FuzzySlappybag #21 Posted 29 November 2018 - 08:55 PM

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I wouldn't say that the +-2 matchmaking is bad on it's own, I find a lot of tier 6's that can still contribute playing in my usual aggressive way when bottom tier (I'm not one to change to a playstyle I don't find fun just so I can contribute). However it needs to be altered to to take into account that stock tanks shouldn't be matched in the same way as it's fully upgraded brethren, case in point, the Hellcat. When fully upgraded a Hellcat can hurt most tier 8s but when stock it struggles to even hurt it's own tier, add to this the fact that matchmaker could well put a Hellcat on each team but one could be the 90mm version and one stock which instantly leaves the teams unbalanced by a tank.

On top of this problem is the fact that it is possible to be one of 2 or 3 (or in some instances the only) bottom tier tank on either team, there is no fun in that especially when it goes big with the top tier heavies. This part doesn't bother me so much in a light tank, as moving to another part of the map is quite quick and I can still get a good amount of spotting damage and act like a vulture for any tanks caught alone. However trundling along on one of the larger maps in your slow heavy to then find the bulk of the top tiers over this part it makes more sense just to die quickly and take another tank out than waste my time trundling all the way back again. That is something that only a bad matchmaker encourages.


Edited by FuzzySlappybag, 29 November 2018 - 08:56 PM.


sledge6301 #22 Posted 29 November 2018 - 09:30 PM

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View PostFuzzySlappybag, on 29 November 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

I wouldn't say that the +-2 matchmaking is bad on it's own, I find a lot of tier 6's that can still contribute playing in my usual aggressive way when bottom tier (I'm not one to change to a playstyle I don't find fun just so I can contribute). However it needs to be altered to to take into account that stock tanks shouldn't be matched in the same way as it's fully upgraded brethren, case in point, the Hellcat. When fully upgraded a Hellcat can hurt most tier 8s but when stock it struggles to even hurt it's own tier, add to this the fact that matchmaker could well put a Hellcat on each team but one could be the 90mm version and one stock which instantly leaves the teams unbalanced by a tank.

On top of this problem is the fact that it is possible to be one of 2 or 3 (or in some instances the only) bottom tier tank on either team, there is no fun in that especially when it goes big with the top tier heavies. This part doesn't bother me so much in a light tank, as moving to another part of the map is quite quick and I can still get a good amount of spotting damage and act like a vulture for any tanks caught alone. However trundling along on one of the larger maps in your slow heavy to then find the bulk of the top tiers over this part it makes more sense just to die quickly and take another tank out than waste my time trundling all the way back again. That is something that only a bad matchmaker encourages.

 

This can be fixed by the changes to +-1 tier MM but my understanding is that WG have the idea that you are more motivated by the current MM and i say that is wrong so lets see how this poll will look like after one month i hope players understand that the possible change is only achivable if WG sees a way of still makin money and i get that cause it is a buisiness and we are happy that we have a game to lay but we want it to be fair and fun to play.

FuzzySlappybag #23 Posted 29 November 2018 - 11:30 PM

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It would definitely solve both problems but I personally would prefer if tanks that can hold their own +2 tiers were allowed to. However I believe that the system exists as it does to encourage the use of premium ammunition and that is not sustainable, particularly for the spammers, without spending money. I have never fired a premium round so don't actually know how many credits people who do actually earn per game but I can't imagine it's a lot.

 


Edited by FuzzySlappybag, 30 November 2018 - 05:23 PM.


TocFanKe4 #24 Posted 01 December 2018 - 05:39 AM

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MM is terrible. I've never seen it this bad. I'm just running 2 player platoons, and getting games where 1 team has 4 or even 5 more top tier tanks than the other.

There's 7-8k players on the server. This shouldn't happen. It used to be better playing with 4k players on the server.

They've done something to MM and it's messing up MM, even without platoons.

NO TEAM SHOULD HAVE MORE THAN 2 TOP TIER TANKS THAN THE OTHER TEAM. 2 SHOULD BE A RARITY.

Can you read that? Simple enough for you? I just played a game where 1 team had 13 tier 6, 1 tier 5, and 1 tier 4. Their tier 4 was arty. Our team had 9 tier 6 and 6 tier 5. How the heck is that balanced?

 

I'd gladly wait an extra minute for MM balance. 


Blue onii chan #25 Posted 02 December 2018 - 03:06 AM

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It's most definitely frustrating, makes grinding out of stock so much harder when you're bottom tier most of the time (From experience T67, D.W.2). That's not taking into consideration how hard it is to do anything with tanks that are just that bad, looking at you Lee...
The MM most obviously needs an update, as in a full update and not some tweaks.
Tbh, I can't think of any T3 that can reliably pen a T5 with average armor for the tier.

sledge6301 #26 Posted 03 December 2018 - 02:40 PM

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View PostTocFanKe4, on 01 December 2018 - 05:39 AM, said:

MM is terrible. I've never seen it this bad. I'm just running 2 player platoons, and getting games where 1 team has 4 or even 5 more top tier tanks than the other.

There's 7-8k players on the server. This shouldn't happen. It used to be better playing with 4k players on the server.

They've done something to MM and it's messing up MM, even without platoons.

NO TEAM SHOULD HAVE MORE THAN 2 TOP TIER TANKS THAN THE OTHER TEAM. 2 SHOULD BE A RARITY.

Can you read that? Simple enough for you? I just played a game where 1 team had 13 tier 6, 1 tier 5, and 1 tier 4. Their tier 4 was arty. Our team had 9 tier 6 and 6 tier 5. How the heck is that balanced?

Thats why i started the poll i have never seen such bad MM since last month.

 

Some players wanted the fail platoon fixed but insteed we see all kind of stupid scewed battles one side have arty the other none one side have 8 TD the other 2 ?

 

I understand perfectley well that any player that want to play in a fair fight just give up and stop playing the game or rant over it the motivation is down big time.

 

The only way to change is to keep talking about it and lift it up until WG take it seriousley if ever.

 

It has to be a more competetive mode and i am willing to pay for it.



sledge6301 #27 Posted 03 December 2018 - 02:52 PM

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View PostFuzzySlappybag, on 29 November 2018 - 11:30 PM, said:

It would definitely solve both problems but I personally would prefer if tanks that can hold their own +2 tiers were allowed to. However I believe that the system exists as it does to encourage the use of premium ammunition and that is not sustainable, particularly for the spammers, without spending money. I have never fired a premium round so don't actually know how many credits people who do actually earn per game but I can't imagine it's a lot.

 

I dont think there can be a way to keep specific tanks in to any exception and one of thenproblems is that we as a community cant come to terms with what we want.

 

I guess my point is i prefere a fair fight whitin the same tier before anything else cause fair and square gaming is more pleasant and motivates me to play on a higher level.

 

There are players that avoid tier X just because of the MM and why have a game with a endgoal playing against the very tanks you just grinded trough.?

 

TierX should be the highest possible adrenaline hard super deluxe end goal battle play and by doing so the tier X can be much higher skill roof and not having to deal,with lower tier at all.



Darkwarryos #28 Posted 04 December 2018 - 08:24 AM

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Please change MM, what a sad night yesterday :( Type 5 cost a lot :teethhappy: But as I'm big and heavy, I often the last one of my team and it's often a 1 vs 6-7 (sometimes 1 vs 10-12), seriously, that's impossible! Youtubers who show a game where there are 1 vs many, and they win, have skills for sure, but a good quantity of luck too!

sledge6301 #29 Posted 04 December 2018 - 09:14 AM

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View PostDarkwarryos, on 04 December 2018 - 08:24 AM, said:

Please change MM, what a sad night yesterday :( Type 5 cost a lot :teethhappy: But as I'm big and heavy, I often the last one of my team and it's often a 1 vs 6-7 (sometimes 1 vs 10-12), seriously, that's impossible! Youtubers who show a game where there are 1 vs many, and they win, have skills for sure, but a good quantity of luck too!

 

Youtubers dont share crappy games and i am actuall thinking about starting one i mean why not i am bad enough i dont care to be the shame guy most of us have the entire day in shame it might not be on the WG most wanted list but why not showing the trouth about how the game is in reality.

 

We all have games that stands out as good but the majority is not worth even meantioning.



Stahlbrezel #30 Posted 04 December 2018 - 10:10 AM

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View Postsledge6301, on 27 November 2018 - 07:23 PM, said:

 

I tryed hard to argue for this change mainly because the premiumtanks use stock tank guns and dont really cope with tierX tanks.

 

In lower tier it is not being the end of the world but for tierVIII in many cases it is just used as food and there is not fun and kill some of the motivation to spend time in the game there ,there are players that find it amusing but my guess is it is rare and most of them use that as a way to show there superiority and nothing wrong by that.

 

The reason for me to argue about in pariculair tierVIII is the silver you need to spend on premiumshells and consumables makit almost impossibel to use the tank as a silver maker or crewtrainer and that is the hole idea about buying a premium tank in the first place.

 

I dont say that all tierVIII are bad but i say that they are not good enough to be a huge part in tierX gameplay.

 

Personally I don't think MM is the real issue. Don't get me wrong... i don't yell hooray when i'm thrown into a tier X match. But in a King Tiger/Motherland/P.Victoria/SkorpionG you ~can~ find ur role in a X match... the big problem is the dependency on ur team esp. the high tiers. And here i find it sometimes hard to believe, how huge the delta of player-skills are... i often don't even see much difference between T5 and T10 games. My plea would be... make WR, KD, played games, WN8... whatever be part of the matchmaking process and reduce platoons to 3 tanks... then nobody would have an issue with +-2...

 

Hmm...except for gloryhunters , pools- and Moe-collectors maybe ;-)


Edited by Stahlbrezel, 04 December 2018 - 10:14 AM.

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sledge6301 #31 Posted 04 December 2018 - 10:32 AM

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View PostStahlbrezel, on 04 December 2018 - 10:10 AM, said:

 

Personally I don't think MM is the real issue. Don't get me wrong... i don't yell hooray when i'm thrown into a tier X match. But in a King Tiger/Motherland/P.Victoria/SkorpionG you ~can~ find ur role in a X match... the big problem is the dependency on ur team esp. the high tiers. And here i find it sometimes hard to believe, how huge the delta of player-skills are... i often don't even see much difference between T5 and T10 games. My plea would be... make WR, KD, played games, WN8... whatever be part of the matchmaking process and reduce platoons to 3 tanks... then nobody would have an issue with +-2...

 

Hmm...except for gloryhunters , pools- and Moe-collectors maybe ;-)

 

I kindley disagree upon using any form of player rating or individuall stats as part of a multiplayer mode but i am willing to discuss if WG decides to open up for a competetive mode whith try outs or some sort of do i belong here.

 

First though lets have this tier based and tank baced as upon the team layouts lights.mediums.etc.

 

The mode will obviosley be for thoose to choice to be a art of that game mode meaning it will cost more in terms of premium time and load out costs i will stretch myself to have this only paid by gold but that is me really wanting this to happen.

 

I already beenmthinkingabout this forma long time so i want WG to use the battle stats and tankstats and stop using beta or supertests as a way to balance the game or tanks in this way there is no need at all.

 

To even go beyond the mode itself this could be a foundation to real competetive gaming in wot console.

 

There is a big player base so it cant be rocket sience to see this in the future as a next.

 



Stahlbrezel #32 Posted 04 December 2018 - 01:39 PM

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Sorry Sledge... English is only my 2nd language, what exactly is ur issue with balancing tanks and player-skills? or did i get it wrong?

Edited by Stahlbrezel, 04 December 2018 - 01:40 PM.

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sledge6301 #33 Posted 05 December 2018 - 09:39 PM

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View PostStahlbrezel, on 04 December 2018 - 01:39 PM, said:

Sorry Sledge... English is only my 2nd language, what exactly is ur issue with balancing tanks and player-skills? or did i get it wrong?

 

Sorry i am from Sweden so my bad also my ipad is crazy.

 

Playerstats is a bad way to balance tanks just because the players change all the time some quits some get beeter and some stop playing that tank because of reasons anyway it changes the data read constantley and that is a bad way to use as a template for balancing anything.

 

Win rate is also bad WG proved that last balance attempt.

 

I am not even sure i want all tanks to be in balance because they are not in any way more then just simulair .

 

example one tierX battle a IS7 meets a Vindicator or a Vengance ? And the is ?

 

example two Tier X battle a IS7 meets a IS7 and the winner is? The best commander.......or RNG .i rest my case this is what a game not in balance looks like and it is not about the tanks it is about the MM.



Fightomonkey #34 Posted 09 December 2018 - 10:36 PM

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I mostly play tier tens and, honestly, I feel like +1/-1 matchmaking would work to distinguish console from PC in a good way-- not in a cheesy, Merc tank way. I also agree that the new light tank meta blows and I'm a huge fan of light tanks. Lastly, I've seen matchmaking lately where the enemy has 5 or 6 more top tier tanks, so apparently matchmaking has pooped the bed. 


CeetjeBeetje #35 Posted Yesterday, 12:09 PM

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In any multiplayer game - if skill is not a factor - you should be able to win a 1 on 1 battle. If not, that means the game is not balanced. Balancing games should be the main focus of any company.

I get that WG did this by having around the same tiers on every team. But if I go into a tier IX match with my tier VII French light tank, I don't stand a chance against any of the IX tanks. I equip HE shells and maybe after 4 shots I do 40 damage (because no way I will ever get a penetration). But if I get spotted and don't move like crazy immediately, I get annihilated with one shot. It's absolutely unfair.

The other way around is of course more fun. Me being tier VII vs tier V, but I do feel kinda dirty when I can easily kill a heavy tank with 2-3 shots.

I'm all for -1+1!



CarriedCheese60 #36 Posted Yesterday, 12:32 PM

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 It's absolutely insane. I was playing a tier 10 battle the other night. My team had a full platoon (5) of tier 8's as well as a tier 8 arty. The opposition had ZERO tier 8's. How is this fair? It's like wargaming is saying thank you for getting together with your friends and playing our game.  Not.and it's not like this is a rare thing. A lot of times our clan will have 7 or 10 guys on and I'd rather play by myself than platoon up. And they think merc tanks are going to overcome this issue? I think not. And how many people on this thread actually think wargaming will look at this ? 

sledge6301 #37 Posted Yesterday, 02:03 PM

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View PostCeetjeBeetje, on 12 December 2018 - 12:09 PM, said:

In any multiplayer game - if skill is not a factor - you should be able to win a 1 on 1 battle. If not, that means the game is not balanced. Balancing games should be the main focus of any company.

I get that WG did this by having around the same tiers on every team. But if I go into a tier IX match with my tier VII French light tank, I don't stand a chance against any of the IX tanks. I equip HE shells and maybe after 4 shots I do 40 damage (because no way I will ever get a penetration). But if I get spotted and don't move like crazy immediately, I get annihilated with one shot. It's absolutely unfair.

The other way around is of course more fun. Me being tier VII vs tier V, but I do feel kinda dirty when I can easily kill a heavy tank with 2-3 shots.

I'm all for -1+1!

I would arguee that skill is more a show off to make a point and having marked some tanks just recentley to prove my theory it goes like this.

 

I have the Crysler K and that was at 62.45 % damagestanding i play that tank everyday because of the 2x but i stopped cause i wanted to mark my Captive Tiger it took me 2 days doing that when i returned to the Crysler K i had a decent game and looked at the damage standing and to my suprice it have fallen to below 58% this is just ridicoulous because it means that when you have like me 180 tanks in the garage there is no chance to mark any tank whithout a stupid grind and because it is a premiumtank it will take even more battles to do so.

 

The reason for marking tanks is dead for me i dont ever if not this changes.

 

Changes to the MM is what i going to go have as a goal for 2019 and i will be percistent i will be loud i will be writing all over the channels about this cause we must have a change if not the game will lose players in rapid speed.

 

The game needs to be more fair and fun and we need more players not less.

 

WG get your act together.







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