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op gold matchmaker artillery

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Mr__Maciej #1 Posted 09 April 2019 - 07:24 AM

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I'm going to keep this short and just list off some problems I've noticed recently.

1. Gold! Gold everywhere! it seems like i'm always getting gold spammed by at least somebody once every match. Either make it cost more silver so its an active decision to fire more expensive shells or make it so they do less damage please. another idea is have it so premium shells can only be used by low tier vehicles (just have tier X's do less damage).

2. The matchmaker is broken and needs a serious overhaul. it matches people not based on skill but on types of tanks. A way to fix it would be a simple check before matching people. check their win rate and try to find someone with similar stats and place them on the opposite team. this way the battles would be a bit more balanced.

        a. platoons. platoons need a little work in the match maker too just a simple fix like only pairing platoons of equal number and tier would help. one arty per platoon too. speaking of arty.

3. ARTILLERY! i understand the idea of why arty was implemented into world of tanks but i don't agree with it, and i'm not alone. many people want a serious rework of the arty. some ideas are. straight up less damage, with higher splash as compensation. less arty per match. no arty on city or small maps. (why would a commander bring a arty piece into town anyways?) and remove all not high explosive types of ammo from artillery. (it just doesn't make sense to fire a chunk of metal at the enemy if it's not going to explode.)

4. Overpowered heavies. i know the counter argument to  this point already is get gud  but its really hard to get any better when your opponent has no frontal weak spots. all that does is encourage more gold spam. please add a weak spot to the majority of the heavies to make skill and knowledge of tanks useful again.

Please leave any more suggestion down below and please tell me how you feel about these points. i'd love to hear some feed back.



Warthog II #2 Posted 09 April 2019 - 08:27 AM

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fwiw

 

1: that's a buff to higher tier tanks in a game and to heavily armored tanks.  It's also a nerf to most tanks with slower standard shell velocity or poor standard pen.

2:   winrate overall or in that tier?    Is platoon winrate taken into account?  Someone that hangs out around tier 6 and lower with a 50% solo winrate is basically 100% likely to be less skilled than someone that plays usually tier 8+ and has a 50% solo winrate.

3: I like the less alpha idea.  Maybe have the splash drop off quicker of distance or have it unable to directly pen tanks.   The no arty on city maps, that just makes them more likely on other maps though.

 

Which tanks don't have frontal weakspots vs same tier tanks in the game?

 


Edited by Warthog II, 09 April 2019 - 08:28 AM.

  

Some people claim Ensk should be tier restricted.   I don't believe their lies. 

Imagine if this forum had only players who actually win more than lose trying to tell others how to play. Would be the best forum ever. Instead, we have a bunch of bad advice from players who lose more often than not trying to tell their betters how to play their tanks.

 


sergeant-slow741 #3 Posted 09 April 2019 - 08:30 AM

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Mr__Maciej #4 Posted 09 April 2019 - 08:50 AM

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Warthog II,

I agree with you on your first point however in the low to mid tiers gold spam is a very serious problem. gold spam is even worse with premium tanks due to their increased earn rate. so my point still stands that it needs to either cost more or do less damage for those popular premium tanks. I'm a decent player who can hold his own but as soon as i see gold shells i know my chances of winning the encounter have gone down tremendously.

your second point brings up WR for each tier which i didn't even think of. that's actually an awesome idea. obviously it wont work for new players and the MM might have some problems with it at first but i like it overall. as for platoon WR i don't think there are enough people at one time all the time for even platoon matchmaking. a platoon of three KV-2's with a WR combined of 50% more than likely will destroy a platoon of equivalent Tier Vi's with a WR of 50% just due to the KV-2 being extremely OP. so i'm not sure how to make platoon MM better other than trying same tier platoons.

And finally as for seeing more arty in non city maps if all other debuffs are applied i wouldn't mind the change. i know it's not the best idea i just wanted opinions.



dave mg 04 #5 Posted 09 April 2019 - 09:28 AM

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View PostMr__Maciej, on 09 April 2019 - 07:24 AM, said:

I'm going to keep this short and just list off some problems I've noticed recently.

1. Gold! Gold everywhere! it seems like i'm always getting gold spammed by at least somebody once every match. Either make it cost more silver so its an active decision to fire more expensive shells or make it so they do less damage please. another idea is have it so premium shells can only be used by low tier vehicles (just have tier X's do less damage).

2. The matchmaker is broken and needs a serious overhaul. it matches people not based on skill but on types of tanks. A way to fix it would be a simple check before matching people. check their win rate and try to find someone with similar stats and place them on the opposite team. this way the battles would be a bit more balanced.

        a. platoons. platoons need a little work in the match maker too just a simple fix like only pairing platoons of equal number and tier would help. one arty per platoon too. speaking of arty.

3. ARTILLERY! i understand the idea of why arty was implemented into world of tanks but i don't agree with it, and i'm not alone. many people want a serious rework of the arty. some ideas are. straight up less damage, with higher splash as compensation. less arty per match. no arty on city or small maps. (why would a commander bring a arty piece into town anyways?) and remove all not high explosive types of ammo from artillery. (it just doesn't make sense to fire a chunk of metal at the enemy if it's not going to explode.)

4. Overpowered heavies. i know the counter argument to  this point already is get gud  but its really hard to get any better when your opponent has no frontal weak spots. all that does is encourage more gold spam. please add a weak spot to the majority of the heavies to make skill and knowledge of tanks useful again.

Please leave any more suggestion down below and please tell me how you feel about these points. i'd love to hear some feed back.

nimber 4 is easy just run about in a french autoloader and do the ring of death..:trollface:



Mr__Maciej #6 Posted 09 April 2019 - 09:32 AM

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View Postdave mg 04, on 09 April 2019 - 09:28 AM, said:

nimber 4 is easy just run about in a french autoloader and do the ring of death..:trollface:

 

true. but i'm talking heavy vs heavy. get your pesky autoloaders out of here. lol

matematicalone #7 Posted 09 April 2019 - 09:48 AM

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1. I was confused with first one, gold spammed? Then I realized you're talking about premium ammo. It's purchasable for silver and it's only limited by amount of silver you have at your disposal, so there is your answer. If you feel salty because you get a lot of prammo spam, just return a favor in equal measure.

2. MM is faulty that's a fact. platoons especially influence mm in a bad way. Equaling at least tier of platoons would be a huge step forward. 5 men tier 8 platoon can't have same value as 5 men tier 10 platoon.

3. Arty is here, few people like it, but learn to live with it. i agree about small urban maps, but I think they need to be reworked in general and there sholdn't be any maps smaller than 1000x1000 meters. Ensk is especially annoying cause it hosts tier 10 and spotting range of some tanks is from edge to edge of that map, hence everyone and their grandma is spotted during first 3 seconds.

4. Overpowered heavy armor? See number 1. for the answer.



 


Mr__Maciej #8 Posted 09 April 2019 - 10:00 AM

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View Postmatematicalone, on 09 April 2019 - 09:48 AM, said:

1. I was confused with first one, gold spammed? Then I realized you're talking about premium ammo. It's purchasable for silver and it's only limited by amount of silver you have at your disposal, so there is your answer. If you feel salty because you get a lot of prammo spam, just return a favor in equal measure.

2. MM is faulty that's a fact. platoons especially influence mm in a bad way. Equaling at least tier of platoons would be a huge step forward. 5 men tier 8 platoon can't have same value as 5 men tier 10 platoon.

3. Arty is here, few people like it, but learn to live with it. i agree about small urban maps, but I think they need to be reworked in general and there sholdn't be any maps smaller than 1000x1000 meters. Ensk is especially annoying cause it hosts tier 10 and spotting range of some tanks is from edge to edge of that map, hence everyone and their grandma is spotted during first 3 seconds.

4. Overpowered heavy armor? See number 1. for the answer.

 

the whole premium ammo thing just upsets me. i don't want to feel like i have to use it just to keep up with my opposition. again i know it's not going away, but it needs to change. i want my armor to mean something. i want my opponents to use their skill to kill me by shooting my weak spots not just give up and fire premium ammo.

 

as for arty. i have dealt and have been dealt one hit kills. the only thing is i didn't feel accomplished by striking my enemy when he cant even see me and fire back. now with the KV-2 for example i can dish out one hit kills and be totally fine with it because then my 20 second reload can be capitalized on and i can and have died after only getting one shot away. that was fair. arty isn't. 



matematicalone #9 Posted 09 April 2019 - 10:32 AM

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View PostMr__Maciej, on 09 April 2019 - 11:00 AM, said:

 

the whole premium ammo thing just upsets me. i don't want to feel like i have to use it just to keep up with my opposition. again i know it's not going away, but it needs to change. i want my armor to mean something. i want my opponents to use their skill to kill me by shooting my weak spots not just give up and fire premium ammo.

 

as for arty. i have dealt and have been dealt one hit kills. the only thing is i didn't feel accomplished by striking my enemy when he cant even see me and fire back. now with the KV-2 for example i can dish out one hit kills and be totally fine with it because then my 20 second reload can be capitalized on and i can and have died after only getting one shot away. that was fair. arty isn't.

 

There are tanks which can't pen themselves with standard ammo, so what would be your solution for that problem? Take E100 for example. AP pen has been buffed but even with a buff it's still insuficient to penetrate E100's armor if properly positioned and angled and with lfp covered. Also your armor does mean something if you angle it properly. E100 is one of the tanks that gets a lot of prammo spam, more than once i've heard people switching to prammo at the start of the match if teamlists show E100 or Maus. But you can bounce heat rounds too you know, apcr can bounce same as ap round, it's just the matter of angles.


 


Mr__Maciej #10 Posted 09 April 2019 - 11:02 AM

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View Postmatematicalone, on 09 April 2019 - 10:32 AM, said:

 

There are tanks which can't pen themselves with standard ammo, so what would be your solution for that problem? Take E100 for example. AP pen has been buffed but even with a buff it's still insuficient to penetrate E100's armor if properly positioned and angled and with lfp covered. Also your armor does mean something if you angle it properly. E100 is one of the tanks that gets a lot of prammo spam, more than once i've heard people switching to prammo at the start of the match if teamlists show E100 or Maus. But you can bounce heat rounds too you know, apcr can bounce same as ap round, it's just the matter of angles.

 

WG should rebalance those tanks to be able to penetrate those tanks with a straight unangled shot to the enemy's weaker spot lets say flat armor on the e 100's cheeks.this would encourage more skilled game play instead of everything penning each other most of the time.

 

okay lets remove premium ammo from the equation and say two equally skilled people are fighting each other in e 100's. assuming that they both know how to angle and hide the weak spots the battle would go something like this. T 1 fires. T 2 bounces and returns fire. T 1 bounces and 20 seconds later fires, and bounces. eventually one of them would have to move and try to gain ground on the opponent. all while angling and attempting to hide weak spot. lets say in doing so the first tank takes one clean shot to the lower plate and it goes through but now he is right next to the other E 100 and can get a clean shot into the side. a hugging battle would then ensue with even more angling. all in all it would be very funny to watch. but unless one of them makes a mistake the game will end in a draw. it all comes down to players skill instead of players bank account.



matematicalone #11 Posted 09 April 2019 - 11:11 AM

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View PostMr__Maciej, on 09 April 2019 - 12:02 PM, said:

 

WG should rebalance those tanks to be able to penetrate those tanks with a straight unangled shot to the enemy's weaker spot lets say flat armor on the e 100's cheeks.this would encourage more skilled game play instead of everything penning each other most of the time.

 

okay lets remove premium ammo from the equation and say two equally skilled people are fighting each other in e 100's. assuming that they both know how to angle and hide the weak spots the battle would go something like this. T 1 fires. T 2 bounces and returns fire. T 1 bounces and 20 seconds later fires, and bounces. eventually one of them would have to move and try to gain ground on the opponent. all while angling and attempting to hide weak spot. lets say in doing so the first tank takes one clean shot to the lower plate and it goes through but now he is right next to the other E 100 and can get a clean shot into the side. a hugging battle would then ensue with even more angling. all in all it would be very funny to watch. but unless one of them makes a mistake the game will end in a draw. it all comes down to players skill instead of players bank account.

 

There are other tanks in battle besides those two e100's. 28 of them to be precise. And some of them would also have problem in penetrating e100's armor. Premium ammo is available for everyone on equal basis, just deal with it. If you choose not to spam that's your choice and your choice only. I happen to be one of those players that choose not to spam prammo, but it's because I'm playing without premium time and my silver is scarce and budget is always thin. Hence I have to learn weakspots choose my shots etc. I assume I would get some 15% better rng if i use only prammo, but I'm good with it as it is. That being said it's not that I don't shoot premium rounds at all. I do carry some, but I use them only against higher tier armor and if math doesn't work to help me.

Oh, and your case of two e100's facing each other would probably end up in both of them spamming he. Which if you think about it is even more unfair than prammo. 15cm gun spamming he can do significant damage and angles won't help much against it. So one may say that HE ammo is unfair and it needs to be removed from game.


Edited by matematicalone, 09 April 2019 - 11:17 AM.


 


V4nquished79 #12 Posted 09 April 2019 - 11:23 AM

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1. I agree - make premium ammo more expensive or with lower dmg like on SU130.

2. When I'm playing platoon 90% of time we are bottem tier and most of the time against enemy top tier platoon. Need to be fixed.

3. Arty must be removed, I'm sick of it, hitted or killed by arty 8 of 10 games. If not removed must be nerfed. 



Mr__Maciej #13 Posted 09 April 2019 - 11:24 AM

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View Postmatematicalone, on 09 April 2019 - 11:11 AM, said:

 

There are other tanks in battle besides those two e100's. 28 of them to be precise. And some of them would also have problem in penetrating e100's armor. Premium ammo is available for everyone on equal basis, just deal with it. If you choose not to spam that's your choice and your choice only. I happen to be one of those players that choose not to spam prammo, but it's because I'm playing without premium time and my silver is scarce and budget is always thin. Hence I have to learn weakspots choose my shots etc. I assume I would get some 15% better rng if i use only prammo, but I'm good with it as it is. That being said it's not that I don't shoot premium rounds at all. I do carry some, but I use them only against higher tier armor and if math doesn't work to help me.

 

to each his own. i know there are tier 8's fighting tier 10's and they have a difficult time penetrating tier 10's. but even a tier 8 med can kill a tier 10 heavy without premium. i'm not saying i have a perfect solution but steps do need to be taken to avoid turning a heavy tank into a exp pinata. i just want my heavy tank to feel like a heavy tank. i want to see my opponents try to out maneuver me to kill me. i respect people like you who know where to shoot me and try their hardest to hit my weakspots. that's world of tanks. not world of premium. i hope you understand what im trying to say.

Mr__Maciej #14 Posted 09 April 2019 - 11:48 AM

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View PostV4nquished79, on 09 April 2019 - 05:23 AM, said:

1. I agree - make premium ammo more expensive or with lower dmg like on SU130.

2. When I'm playing platoon 90% of time we are bottem tier and most of the time against enemy top tier platoon. Need to be fixed.

3. Arty must be removed, I'm sick of it, hitted or killed by arty 8 of 10 games. If not removed must be nerfed. 

 

so you agree with everything? is there any other things that you think should change?

V4nquished79 #15 Posted 10 April 2019 - 01:27 PM

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Yes, remove Deathstars :D 

DOOMSDAY DRONE #16 Posted 11 April 2019 - 09:16 AM

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I have somthing to add

 

Consumables are soo expensive even tho u can only use them once

 



V4nquished79 #17 Posted 11 April 2019 - 11:40 AM

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Oh, one more - mercy shots - it happened 98% of the cases - I make 400 dmg he has 350 life left but I do 330 dmg. And 75% of these case he kills me. But it wasn't happened to me - I have 445 life he makes 400dmg and kills me with one shot...It's RNG all said, but I want RNG to work equal in both directions, not I to suffer every single time.

VeNoMz x Maniac #18 Posted 11 April 2019 - 04:36 PM

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View PostMr__Maciej, on 09 April 2019 - 02:24 AM, said:

I'm going to keep this short and just list off some problems I've noticed recently.

1. Gold! Gold everywhere! it seems like i'm always getting gold spammed by at least somebody once every match. Either make it cost more silver so its an active decision to fire more expensive shells or make it so they do less damage please. another idea is have it so premium shells can only be used by low tier vehicles (just have tier X's do less damage).

2. The matchmaker is broken and needs a serious overhaul. it matches people not based on skill but on types of tanks. A way to fix it would be a simple check before matching people. check their win rate and try to find someone with similar stats and place them on the opposite team. this way the battles would be a bit more balanced.

        a. platoons. platoons need a little work in the match maker too just a simple fix like only pairing platoons of equal number and tier would help. one arty per platoon too. speaking of arty.

3. ARTILLERY! i understand the idea of why arty was implemented into world of tanks but i don't agree with it, and i'm not alone. many people want a serious rework of the arty. some ideas are. straight up less damage, with higher splash as compensation. less arty per match. no arty on city or small maps. (why would a commander bring a arty piece into town anyways?) and remove all not high explosive types of ammo from artillery. (it just doesn't make sense to fire a chunk of metal at the enemy if it's not going to explode.)

4. Overpowered heavies. i know the counter argument to  this point already is get gud  but its really hard to get any better when your opponent has no frontal weak spots. all that does is encourage more gold spam. please add a weak spot to the majority of the heavies to make skill and knowledge of tanks useful again.

Please leave any more suggestion down below and please tell me how you feel about these points. i'd love to hear some feed back.

 

well going off the arty thing   they already made it so there cant be no more than three per side  and if  they make the arty do less damage but higher splash  people would complain about the round landing no where near and still doing damage,  and get rid of  H.E's? then there would be no point in having splash damage since all arty would be shooting AP rounds.... but with the low health points of the arty and being paper thin and long reload time along with long aim time plus as  inaccurate as you get higher up in the tiers. very low mobility and camo factor;     you take a way the damage of arty it becomes a light tank that cant protect it self... and basically arty is defenseless as is once everyone stops protecting it.. once you come up on arty  its done for ( unless said person is an excellent arty player) he shoots and misses or splash damages and does little damage   that long reload and low mobility is its weak points  so whats the point in nerfing something that doesnt need to be nerfed.. yes arty is good but really with the way the terrain is on most maps arty doesn't have it easy, especially on small maps, town maps , maps with mountains     the arty player has to compensate for everything going on around them. so if you ask me...     no need to nerf artillery , arty is fine just the way it is :)     

V4nquished79 #19 Posted 12 April 2019 - 12:34 PM

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Most of the time the arties are hidden, defenseless are players with normal tanks - we can't watch the sky if it will rains...Why on PC the arties are different? 

Adrian9704 #20 Posted 13 April 2019 - 07:42 PM

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View PostVeNoMz x Maniac, on 11 April 2019 - 04:36 PM, said:

 

get rid of  H.E's? then there would be no point in having splash damage since all arty would be shooting AP rounds.... 

The guy wanted to remove everything BUT H.E. from arty.....







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