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Matchmaking tier imbalance limit


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mockney_piers #1 Posted 23 April 2019 - 07:15 AM

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I was under the impression that you shouldn't have greater than a 5 tier imbalance between teams

ie team a) 10 X 5 IX, team b) 5 X 10 IX

 

Did i make that up in my head? Maybe I'm thinking of Blitz?

5 is usually a loss but it's surprising how often it can be overcome.

 

It's just I''m seeing this sort of thing, a 7 tier imbalance, more often, and this didn't go well.

The worse the imbalance the harder it is to overcome, especially bottom tier.

Probably to do with handling platoons i imagine, but I'd rather have 10 v 10 than messes like this.

 

Have WG tried using machine learning to drive the matchmaking I wonder, probably worth a go.

 



Rubbelito #2 Posted 23 April 2019 - 08:03 AM

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I'm not 100%, but I don't think there are any such limits. It's all about weight, except for arties and lights that have a diff limit.

BoereJack #3 Posted 23 April 2019 - 08:23 AM

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a platoon of 4 or more(tier 8’s), which is matched against a platoon of 4 or more(in this case tier 9’s) so nothing wrong here

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dzhey43 #4 Posted 23 April 2019 - 08:31 AM

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View PostBoereJack, on 23 April 2019 - 11:23 AM, said:

a platoon of 4 or more(tier 8’s), which is matched against a platoon of 4 or more(in this case tier 9’s) so nothing wrong here

 

Green team had a fun game than...))
Spoiler

BoereJack #5 Posted 23 April 2019 - 08:33 AM

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View Postdzhey43, on 23 April 2019 - 08:31 AM, said:

 

Green team had a fun game than...))

 

easy ace tanker games:izmena:

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f1mitku #6 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:15 AM

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There is no team imbalance limit at all. Whereas it should be 0 tolerance. But obviously WG intentionally wants this frustration to stay. 
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M4ntiX #7 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:23 AM

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View Postmockney_piers, on 23 April 2019 - 07:15 AM, said:

I was under the impression that you shouldn't have greater than a 5 tier imbalance between teams

ie team a) 10 X 5 IX, team b) 5 X 10 IX

 

Did i make that up in my head? Maybe I'm thinking of Blitz?

5 is usually a loss but it's surprising how often it can be overcome.

 

It's just I''m seeing this sort of thing, a 7 tier imbalance, more often, and this didn't go well.

The worse the imbalance the harder it is to overcome, especially bottom tier.

Probably to do with handling platoons i imagine, but I'd rather have 10 v 10 than messes like this.

 

Have WG tried using machine learning to drive the matchmaking I wonder, probably worth a go.

 

So... did you win? :)

 

Don't get me wrong, uneven matchmaking annoys me as much as the next guy, but I love turning the odds around and winning despite of unfair team distribution.

Always brings a big a** smile on my face and wouldn't be possible if the matchmaking was super fair and even. So, was it one of those games?


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mockney_piers #8 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:29 AM

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View PostM4ntiX, on 23 April 2019 - 09:23 AM, said:

 

So... did you win? :)

 

Don't get me wrong, uneven matchmaking annoys me as much as the next guy, but I love turning the odds around and winning despite of unfair team distribution.

Always brings a big a** smile on my face and wouldn't be possible if the matchmaking was super fair and even. So, was it one of those games?

 

it didn't go well.

The reds concentrated largely in the middle, the greens scattered randomly. So our core heavies were quickly overwhelmed and obliterated. The rest of the game was just picking the greens off.

Total steamroller, as much thanks to tactics than imbalance.

I went 2nd line middle and might have lasted a little longer if I'd had the top turret, as it was i think i landed 2 shots before being ganked by the WIN_8 toon and finished 6th or 7th on the board.

 

But I agree it is fab when you overcome, which shows games are won or lost by many vagaries, not simply the MM, or even player skill.

 

I've been known to analyse all 30 players' stats on total steamrollers (i'm a very boring data obsessed geek) and by rights the losing side should have obliterated the winning one.

Sometimes sh*t just happens.



M4ntiX #9 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:33 AM

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View Postmockney_piers, on 23 April 2019 - 09:29 AM, said:

 

it didn't go well.

The reds concentrated largely in the middle, the greens scattered randomly. So our core heavies we overwhelmed and obliterated. The rest of the game was just picking the greens off.

Total steamroller, as much thanks to tactics than imbalance.

I went 2nd line middle and might have lasted a little longer if I'd had the top turret, as it was i think i landed 2 shots before being ganked by the WIN_8 toon and finished 6th or 7th on the board.

 

Bummer, sorry to hear that. Unfortunately that's usually how it goes, but when it doesn't and you manage to pull a win, it's a battle to remember. :)

Anyways, think of it this way, next time you will be on the team with all the tier IX and X tanks and will be the one who dominates. That's how this game works.


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mockney_piers #10 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:36 AM

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yeah, we've had a few wins on toon night that overcame such odds.

When you know you can trust 4 good players (most FILTHs are alot better than me!!) around you it gives you that extra edge.



Koncorde #11 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:40 AM

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Had a match last night where it was tier IX. Apart from they had 5 tier 8's and we had 1 tier 8 (arty) and 4 tier 7's.

They had one tier 8 platoons. We had two two man platoons, which were the 7's. Logic would suggest the two 7's should have been on opposite teams which would have made the matchmaking 100% equal.

No lights to screw the matchmaking either.

markyjmeech #12 Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:45 AM

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This MM looks to be within the limit due to all tank in the battle are =2/-2 MM,and depends on tank classes also within the platoon,also large platoons will also be paired against other such platoons first, but i can double check to see if this is incorrect :honoring:

 

 

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Sadriel Fett #13 Posted 23 April 2019 - 10:04 AM

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I believe large platoons take precedence in match making.  They try to pair the large platoons up first because they're weighted differently, then populate the rest of the teams with whatever is left.  At least, according to the game guide on match making.

 

https://console.worl...mm-explained/#4

 

Battles involving multiple Platoons tend to create Balance Weight issues. To address this, when there's a surplus of Platoons in the queue, the matchmaker will select the Platoons first and fill the missing gaps with solo players.

 

 

I'm guessing that's probably what happened here.

 


 

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mockney_piers #14 Posted 23 April 2019 - 10:16 AM

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cheers, i figured toons were probably at fault, and clearly the limit was all in my head :)

mockney_piers #15 Posted 24 April 2019 - 01:02 PM

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View PostM4ntiX, on 23 April 2019 - 09:23 AM, said:

 

So... did you win? :)

 

 

Ha, I've just noticed i twut the result screenshot, totally forgot I'd done that which may be a reflection of the amount of alcohol inside me that midnight :D

 



Reaper0fGamez #16 Posted 24 April 2019 - 04:28 PM

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This kind of mm [edited]has been happening for months (I play on the PS4 too) and its pathetic to be put into the weaker team especially when youre playing Tier 8 tanks like OP was in the screenshot.

 

TBH platoon vs platoon matchup isnt a legitimate excuse here, a better MM system could have put 2 solo tier 8 tanks to the red team and vice versa.


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TsprinTs #17 Posted 25 April 2019 - 02:20 AM

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The worst I have seen was 8 tier difference.

Most of this broken MM can be even out by just swaping a couple tanks.  But WG said their Engineer could not figure out how to do that.



ArnaudMoa #18 Posted 25 April 2019 - 10:51 AM

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I still don't understand why WG doesn't hire competent staff to fix MM and bug problems while they continue to collect players' money. :/

mockney_piers #19 Posted 25 April 2019 - 11:24 AM

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I honestly think, given the vast amount of data they have, that machine learning could be a good tool to make MM both quicker and better, than using clunky, flawed deterministic algorithms.

And by its nature it could take things like player stats into account to attain certain goals.

Personally I'd like to see that used to aim for closer matches rather than to bucket players of like skill into discrete matches.



Rubbelito #20 Posted 25 April 2019 - 11:51 AM

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View Postmockney_piers, on 25 April 2019 - 01:24 PM, said:

 

And by its nature it could take things like player stats into account to attain certain goals.

Personally I'd like to see that used to aim for closer matches rather than to bucket players of like skill into discrete matches.

 

I certainly understand the incentive, but as soon as you consider any form of player skill you're also making WR irrelevant.

Not something I'd like to see.






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