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C'mon WG -This is Just Stupid

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redshadowrider #1 Posted 25 May 2019 - 07:16 PM

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If you are gonna ignore the pleas to fix the MM, ok so be it.  However, if you are going to have 28 tanks from Tiers 8 and 9, make it 30.  Just played my IS Tier 7 and we and the Reds had only 1 tier 7 each.  So, the two of us made up the bottom tier.  You could have, at the very least, dropped each of us for another 8 or 9.  It's not like there aren't enough players in the mid afternoon.  And to top it off, I was killed by Big Hundy....how embarrassing is that?...another forumer.  ;)
I'm just saying.....

Fishfood50 #2 Posted 25 May 2019 - 07:43 PM

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For me this is the only real problem with the MM. There should be a limit on the number of bottom tier tanks, I'd say 5, but 3 would be acceptable.

redshadowrider #3 Posted 25 May 2019 - 07:49 PM

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Funny, the very next game I played my Sherman Jumbo Tier 6 in a tier 8 match.  Only 2 Tier 6 tanks on each team, same result.  I am not a conspiracy theorist, but the roll over losses, shots that don't pen or do damage,  constant bottom or middle tier have raised my frustration level pretty high.  It's gaming like this that keep me from wondering why so much prammo is in use.  It is getting to the point that it is the ammo of choice. 

 

Oh yeah, forgot to add, all 4 tier 6 tanks did not make it to the end of the match.  Those players that want the 2 tier rule removed are fast getting my support.  And that is after 5 years of the way it is now.


I'm just saying.....

Sammael85 #4 Posted 25 May 2019 - 08:46 PM

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The game just wanted to give you more exp. and you complain? That's lame :popcorn:

 

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HomicidalApple0 #5 Posted 25 May 2019 - 09:13 PM

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I feel this is also the only real issue with mm. It should never be unbalanced amount of tiers per team or only one bottom tier per game. 1 8 per team against a majority of 10s and some 9s is never a fun situation to spawn into

Brass Drag0n #6 Posted 25 May 2019 - 10:29 PM

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View Postredshadowrider, on 25 May 2019 - 07:49 PM, said:

Funny, the very next game I played my Sherman Jumbo Tier 6 in a tier 8 match.  Only 2 Tier 6 tanks on each team, same result.  I am not a conspiracy theorist, but the roll over losses, shots that don't pen or do damage,  constant bottom or middle tier have raised my frustration level pretty high.  It's gaming like this that keep me from wondering why so much prammo is in use.  It is getting to the point that it is the ammo of choice. 

 

Oh yeah, forgot to add, all 4 tier 6 tanks did not make it to the end of the match.  Those players that want the 2 tier rule removed are fast getting my support.  And that is after 5 years of the way it is now.

 

I​ think the Jumbo still gets heavy tank matchmaking, like it did when the game launched. Means it ends up in way more tier 8 games than it should.

 

Because the game clearly hasn't changed in the intervening 5 years as far as WG are concerned.


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Potato QQ #7 Posted 25 May 2019 - 10:33 PM

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MM is unbalanced for a reason. 

 

It's to get players frustrated so they give them $ to convert  XP.

 

Then repeat and rinse until they get to Tier 10.



Vorpallion #8 Posted 25 May 2019 - 10:46 PM

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If I'm the only tier VI in a tier VIII match, if I'm a medium or light, I'm pretty happy. You have to play more cautiously, but you can make it work. 

If I'm a heavy I'm usually quite disappointed. 

Sometimes there isn't even an enemy of your tier to fight. 

redshadowrider #9 Posted 26 May 2019 - 12:00 AM

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View PostBrass Drag0n, on 25 May 2019 - 04:29 PM, said:

 

I​ think the Jumbo still gets heavy tank matchmaking, like it did when the game launched. Means it ends up in way more tier 8 games than it should.

 

Because the game clearly hasn't changed in the intervening 5 years as far as WG are concerned.

 

This I did not know.  Not sure why because I dropped to the tier 5 gun which is the derp version.  I tried the standard (either 75mm or 90 mm) going from memory here.  The standard is the most useless tier 6 gun I can remember.  I got tired of dying because it shoots nothing but  spitballs. 
I'm just saying.....

Vampire_Izumi #10 Posted 26 May 2019 - 12:28 AM

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this is a reason i like the Dreadnought. no matter the tier, you can always ruin a tank with that fantastic 152mm.

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SteampunkPagan #11 Posted 26 May 2019 - 01:40 AM

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Well as usual let me try & strike some middle of the road balance here. First off I 100% agree that there are problems with MM however saying WG is ignoring the issues as far as I can see is simply not true. They have again & again said that they are working on it, that one of the key staff doing so moved away, that they ran into issues & last that they are trying somethings in house. MM is a very complicated thing to fool with if they release a major update with changes & it "breaks the game" then they do more damage than being slow & deliberate. I am also frustrated by MM in sessions I promise you I am, I am frustrated by the team not just tier balance but by the class, battle weight & platoon size/tier balance. I am of the opinion that players should here & on social media continue to post screenshots of things they believe are wrong with MM I very much however believe that the pitchforks should not be brought out just yet. I for one am willing to trust WGCB, PAIN, Max, Rai & Jeff on this right now & give them through the fall to find a solution. I do hope that you all will do the same even though it is at this time very frustrating to deal with.

 

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redshadowrider #12 Posted 26 May 2019 - 02:36 AM

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Steampunk.  Very interesting reply.  It's the first time I have seen a good answer that has good information in it. Thanks....  Now, if this is that crucial and important, why isn't this the response from WG,...and not another player.  Not trying to attack you, just explaining that I am an avid player and forum participant and yet, it's the first time I heard it.  I wonder why that is?
I'm just saying.....

SteampunkPagan #13 Posted 26 May 2019 - 03:06 AM

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View Postredshadowrider, on 25 May 2019 - 09:36 PM, said:

Steampunk.  Very interesting reply.  It's the first time I have seen a good answer that has good information in it. Thanks....  Now, if this is that crucial and important, why isn't this the response from WG,...and not another player.  Not trying to attack you, just explaining that I am an avid player and forum participant and yet, it's the first time I heard it.  I wonder why that is?

All that info has been either shared here, in Battle Hero Q&A or in streams by WG.

 

Though not updated since Feb. 2019 this has several mentions of MM:

http://forum-console...oes-qa-catalog/

 

Are we going to see Matchmaking changes for platoons so that platoons get matched against the same tier platoon?

[PAINGOD] I can file a ticket to investigate how feasible it is with our current matchmaker. I think I’ve mentioned here recently matchmaking changes are currently on hold for a few reasons.

That is from here:

https://console.worl...e-heroes-tier-x

 

And there is more around in those. I just do not have the time to look for them all...Sorry but I hope all that does help or is at the least somewhat useful.

SPP

 

EDIT:

Took the time found some more:

In a previous Q&A, you mentioned you were working on Matchmaking changes. Can you share what those changes are?

That is a long and frustrating story to be sure. In short, we started working on adopting the new matchmaker from PC's version 9.20.1 and ran into problems running simulations on our data. We needed support from the PC team which took a while since they were busy with 1.0 (no fingers, just fact). As you may know, the new Matchmaking on PC didn’t work out as hoped and in under a new review and rewrite. In the meantime, we had an engineer here working on trying to help and find a solution for us. Unfortunately, he had to move out of state and left the company. Now we’re looking for someone to fill those shoes or train up and learn what took the previous did about the system. I wish I had better news for you on this. There is one change we can make to reduce matchmaking complexity a bit that I hope will help at low population times or just odd combinations in the queue. That will be in Update 4.9. More details to come.

 

AND

 

Will you ever consider changing all matchmaking to +1/-1? If not, why?

I would love to, but we can easily see in simulations that it would start causing matchmaking fails at lower and higher tiers. I did have the idea a while ago to try that on a weekend where the numbers might be able to support it. I would still like to do that but haven’t found the time or resources to do that and all the testing.

 

That is from:

https://console.worl...oes-february-12

 

That should help more so.

SPP


Edited by SteampunkPagan, 26 May 2019 - 03:27 AM.

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Cpl Derren #14 Posted 26 May 2019 - 03:10 AM

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View PostSteampunkPagan, on 25 May 2019 - 08:40 PM, said:

Well as usual let me try & strike some middle of the road balance here. First off I 100% agree that there are problems with MM however saying WG is ignoring the issues as far as I can see is simply not true. They have again & again said that they are working on it, that one of the key staff doing so moved away, that they ran into issues & last that they are trying somethings in house. MM is a very complicated thing to fool with if they release a major update with changes & it "breaks the game" then they do more damage than being slow & deliberate. I am also frustrated by MM in sessions I promise you I am, I am frustrated by the team not just tier balance but by the class, battle weight & platoon size/tier balance. I am of the opinion that players should here & on social media continue to post screenshots of things they believe are wrong with MM I very much however believe that the pitchforks should not be brought out just yet. I for one am willing to trust WGCB, PAIN, Max, Rai & Jeff on this right now & give them through the fall to find a solution. I do hope that you all will do the same even though it is at this time very frustrating to deal with.

 

Thanks for reading,

SPP

 

View Postredshadowrider, on 25 May 2019 - 09:36 PM, said:

Steampunk.  Very interesting reply.  It's the first time I have seen a good answer that has good information in it. Thanks....  Now, if this is that crucial and important, why isn't this the response from WG,...and not another player.  Not trying to attack you, just explaining that I am an avid player and forum participant and yet, it's the first time I heard it.  I wonder why that is?

I do agree with what SPP has said, but the question you have asked RSR is one that we can only guess at. My guess is that there are 2 answers to this problem, more than likely both at the same time, but it is memorial day weekend here in the US, so I'm sure some WG employees dont really like, "taking their work home" (even if it might be part of their job?) but it might also be that there there are certain things that employees are not allowed to say as per their contracts. maybe stuff along the lines of tests of certain features being done in-house without the permission of Pain himself and/or the marketing team? 

 

This is just my guess, and may entirely be wrong of course

 

Derren


Edited by Cpl Derren, 26 May 2019 - 03:11 AM.

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mikkoj #15 Posted 26 May 2019 - 06:49 AM

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View PostPotato QQ, on 26 May 2019 - 12:33 AM, said:

MM is unbalanced for a reason. 

 

It's to get players frustrated so they give them $ to convert  XP.

 

Then repeat and rinse until they get to Tier 10.

Yeah it is not working and getting really old really soon. When i am getting triggered you can be sure that people are rage quiting on regular basis. 


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Potato QQ #16 Posted 26 May 2019 - 07:29 AM

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View Postmikkoj, on 25 May 2019 - 10:49 PM, said:

Yeah it is not working and getting really old really soon. When i am getting triggered you can be sure that people are rage quiting on regular basis. 

 

I just switch games.  No reason to get frustrated over a video game. 

MrTrollPacMan #17 Posted 26 May 2019 - 09:20 AM

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The other night I was in playing the Panther II and had a match as the only tier 8, on either team, in a tier 10 game. I pulled out a decent game, but still, that’s terrible mm

redshadowrider #18 Posted 26 May 2019 - 11:56 AM

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Thanks SPP, I didn't expect you to take the time you did to search out so much.  Derren, my comments are more rhetorical as anything.  I didn't really expect a formal WG comment on a holiday weekend.  I think that SPP,  arrived at the reason for me, and probably others not being aware of thei efforts.  Taking the time to find them is something many don't have.  Dissemination of important information is fragmented, and difficult to find.  That may be the core problem in finding answers.  
I'm just saying.....

Cpl Derren #19 Posted 26 May 2019 - 04:54 PM

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View Postredshadowrider, on 26 May 2019 - 06:56 AM, said:

Thanks SPP, I didn't expect you to take the time you did to search out so much.  Derren, my comments are more rhetorical as anything.  I didn't really expect a formal WG comment on a holiday weekend.  I think that SPP,  arrived at the reason for me, and probably others not being aware of thei efforts.  Taking the time to find them is something many don't have.  Dissemination of important information is fragmented, and difficult to find.  That may be the core problem in finding answers.  

 

indeed it is in regards to that last part about information, I was mainly throwing out my answer for those that may not be aware that it is memorial day weekend in the states. nothing directed at you personally. :)

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SteampunkPagan #20 Posted 26 May 2019 - 11:10 PM

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View Postredshadowrider, on 26 May 2019 - 06:56 AM, said:

Thanks SPP, I didn't expect you to take the time you did to search out so much.  Derren, my comments are more rhetorical as anything.  I didn't really expect a formal WG comment on a holiday weekend.  I think that SPP,  arrived at the reason for me, and probably others not being aware of thei efforts.  Taking the time to find them is something many don't have.  Dissemination of important information is fragmented, and difficult to find.  That may be the core problem in finding answers.  

I do agree with what you say about information being fragmented I have taken issue with that since the Beta. That said Battle Heroes is very useful & Rai has tried to put information in single threads here like the one above she is just not able to keep up with it because she is spread so thin. Most CM's have two or three interns this is a AA game & she needs a couple to help one to handle the community contest alone between here & social media contest those have got to be time consuming.

 

Anyway glad I could be of some help here & I hope others find the information helpful as well.

SPP


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