Jump to content


Win ratio keeps staying exactly the same?

wins losses stats draws

  • Please log in to reply
41 replies to this topic

AJH387 #21 Posted 18 June 2019 - 05:52 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 16092 battles
  • 2,565
  • [HLCAT]
  • Member since:
    12-10-2014
I kinda look at this game like how I view batters in baseball. It only is an extra 1 or 2 hits at bat, for every 10 to show a noticable difference in your average. And in this game, a lot of stuff is out of your control (RNG, Teams, situational stuff etc). But the really good / serious players find a way to get those extra few wins out in those tight moments. And that is how they seem to overcome a slump that would effect a lesser player. I know that is what holds me back. I have that game where I do something stupid, just a little too frequently. I have gotten better over time and I think you will also. 


Teffisk #22 Posted 18 June 2019 - 08:09 PM

    Captain

  • Players
  • 24006 battles
  • 1,751
  • [-L7-]
  • Member since:
    10-14-2015
Sounds like to me similar the law of reversion to the mean. If you are a 52% WR player, you may have a streak where you will hit 60%, but the laws of math say you will eventually level out and bring the average back to 52%.

The only way to change this is to change the way you play. Learn and improve. Admitting when you make a mistake that costs the win, your life, or hp is the way to get better. If you blame your team, RNG, or Wargaming conspiracies you will never improve.

redshadowrider #23 Posted 18 June 2019 - 11:10 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 37674 battles
  • 8,304
  • Member since:
    03-17-2014

View PostMilitaryGoose05, on 18 June 2019 - 10:18 AM, said:

Remember the game is also 'balanced' so that almost all players will have a WR between 48-52%, so that bad players don't get frustrated and quit.

 

This is the source of all the complaints about rigged MM. Because yes, MM is rigged to keep the bell curve of WR between 48-52, and will manipulate your matches to keep you there if you start doing really well or really badly.

 

So yes, judge your success by other metrics is the answer.

No offense intended, but I think you hit on what my issue is at its core. If the intent, is to manipulate the bell curve to keep players from quitting, then it is being done incorrectly.  The bell curve is to be the outcome without being created by subjective means.  I submit that, many of the veterans that have quit, have done so for this very reason.  It is certainly the reason that I consider quitting.  I might very well be Joe Average without interference, but I will never find out.  And, even if I am still average, it's my doing, not someone else's trying to manipulate the results.


I'm just saying.....

Junokaii #24 Posted 19 June 2019 - 03:00 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostSPUK4U, on 18 June 2019 - 08:54 AM, said:

 

 If you want to improve your win rate, you need to actually help team to win more.  You can do it just by increasing damage that you do or starting to make right tactical decisions.  Now ask from yourself a simple question: Do you notice base capture only when you hear the siren or do you notice it minute before siren?  If it's the first one, you are not map aware, you are doing your share in damage, but not increasing team's change to win.  Are you playing with radar? If yes change if to default to minimap or keep glancing that large map more often.  Increasing map awareness increases a change that you are the one that makes right tactical decision that helps team to win.  If you are already making good tactical decisions then it's time to think how you can make more damage. You can't increase skills rapidly, but you can  start spending silver in premium ammo and consumables and increase damage output with help of them.  You can have negative silver battles from time to time, but if it's more wins and total silver flow is still positive side then it's okay.  

 

Finally, I have to say advice that I got from older player:  :trollface:

Spoiler

 

 

There's always that one player and their 'get gud' rhetoric. And yes I do help my team, what you think I do after 14k matches? Just stand there and hope we win? You sure you fully read my opening statement, or are you cherry picking things I've said to fit some sort of narrative you got for me? I do plenty to help my team and am consistently in the top 5. But I can't help the stupid things that cause you to lose in this game. My question was, despite all this, why is my wins over losses remaining the same. I consistently do good, and I in fact do the things that have an 'unsung hero' theme to them. My damage given/taken ratio is low because for the longest time, I only played heavy, ever. It's only been in this passed year or two that I have really branched out to other classes. So if anyone needs to help who out more in my case, are my teams.

Junokaii #25 Posted 19 June 2019 - 03:06 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostShockwave IIC, on 18 June 2019 - 12:20 PM, said:

 

There is no "Hard Limit" however at a certain point an individuals ability to improve further stops, whether it be because of Hand-Eye cordination, tactical understanding, Eyesight, the inability to absorb more game info or just motivation to prove "Drive" - Something will cause your ability to improve to come to a halt, your "Skill" will plateau.

 

That's what M4ntix is referring to.

 

Well, I'd like to believe that the reason I'm not consistently improving is that, but to be honest I'm not convinced. It's very very odd how it has remained at 446 more wins than losses for months give or take a few. And consistently my stats crash whenever I go above that. Did you not read my initial post? I said that as an example, a few days ago I got my stats above 460 for the first time in a long time, then proceeded to lose 11 matches in a row. I failed to mention that over the next 20 or so I basically went on a 'win one, lose two-five'. Then it'll proceed to put me on a winning trend back to 446, then proceeds to stay there. That's basically what's going on. To be honest, I've come to the conclusion that winning isn't really up to us. We can do things that can help to try influence that, but I don't think it's up to us. If it were, I'd never lose a match when I have 3+ kills ever. It's not hard at all for my teams to put effort in when I've killed a third of the enemy team and have twice the damage as the person in second place, but still proceed to lose in this case sometimes. Like I said above too, sometimes I get a match and it's over before I have a chance to really do much because my team for once is that good. There's lots of circumstances beyond our control in this game.

Junokaii #26 Posted 19 June 2019 - 03:12 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostAJH387, on 18 June 2019 - 05:52 PM, said:

I kinda look at this game like how I view batters in baseball. It only is an extra 1 or 2 hits at bat, for every 10 to show a noticable difference in your average. And in this game, a lot of stuff is out of your control (RNG, Teams, situational stuff etc). But the really good / serious players find a way to get those extra few wins out in those tight moments. And that is how they seem to overcome a slump that would effect a lesser player. I know that is what holds me back. I have that game where I do something stupid, just a little too frequently. I have gotten better over time and I think you will also. 

 

Oh yeah. I've definitely gotten better. Pretty much on every stat I've improved on. The only thing that hasn't improved is my wins ratio. It's been almost exact like I said for months now or has remained at a certain percentage for even longer, irregardless of how many matches I've had. That's why I'm particularly annoyed at why it's staying the same because I have gotten better and have managed to find a way to contribute far more per match than ever, it's just I still lose how I've always lost. I remember once I killed 8 tanks and still lost the game I mean are you kidding? You could hardly play on a team like that and win but still I lost. Hell, I could've had just one more player step up like me and won. I think I was in my O-HO when that happened, had like 3x the damage as the person in second place.

Junokaii #27 Posted 19 June 2019 - 03:28 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View Postredshadowrider, on 18 June 2019 - 11:10 PM, said:

No offense intended, but I think you hit on what my issue is at its core. If the intent, is to manipulate the bell curve to keep players from quitting, then it is being done incorrectly.  The bell curve is to be the outcome without being created by subjective means.  I submit that, many of the veterans that have quit, have done so for this very reason.  It is certainly the reason that I consider quitting.  I might very well be Joe Average without interference, but I will never find out.  And, even if I am still average, it's my doing, not someone else's trying to manipulate the results.

 

This fits how I feel about this game to a tee in many ways. I actually do not mind losing. But that's just it, I can't stand how I am losing because of things beyond my control and it HAS made me consider leaving as well, because I know I'm better than this. There's no reason I shouldn't be winning at least 52% of the time, since I do my damn-dest to try. So that's why I've really considered 'retiring' from this game because it's a lot of years of frustration over basically nothing. So, I wanna try and go for all the achievements on console then see how I feel.

SirlceCream #28 Posted 19 June 2019 - 04:00 PM

    Staff sergeant

  • Players
  • 19453 battles
  • 481
  • [4LOST]
  • Member since:
    12-11-2016
Which winrate do you think you deserve?

3. Marked Tanks: 85

 


SPUK4U #29 Posted 19 June 2019 - 06:23 PM

    Captain

  • Players
  • 11428 battles
  • 1,950
  • Member since:
    07-24-2018

View PostJunokaii, on 19 June 2019 - 03:00 PM, said:

 

There's always that one player and their 'get gud' rhetoric. And yes I do help my team, what you think I do after 14k matches? Just stand there and hope we win? You sure you fully read my opening statement, or are you cherry picking things I've said to fit some sort of narrative you got for me? I do plenty to help my team and am consistently in the top 5. But I can't help the stupid things that cause you to lose in this game. My question was, despite all this, why is my wins over losses remaining the same. I consistently do good, and I in fact do the things that have an 'unsung hero' theme to them. My damage given/taken ratio is low because for the longest time, I only played heavy, ever. It's only been in this passed year or two that I have really branched out to other classes. So if anyone needs to help who out more in my case, are my teams.

 

You asked why your win ration stays same and I tried to explain that you have to change things to improve, old ways are not improving your Win rate even if they are clearly still working to keep you in your current level.  Many are fine with old ways that work, but it's clearly annoying you so you need to do something to it, break the old habits.  Try to do new thing, things like don't go into valley in the Lakeville go into town type of new things, avoid old familiar spots in the maps, force yourself to learn new spots. You can also make some research, look battle replays and try to figure out what you could have done better, what were your mistakes, not what were the teammates mistake's, those are easy to find.  So Gid-Gud  or accept your fate.  :teethhappy:


- Ask, Observe, Learn and Improve -

RELIC x #30 Posted 19 June 2019 - 07:50 PM

    Captain

  • Players
  • 26893 battles
  • 1,262
  • [47R]
  • Member since:
    08-10-2013

View PostJunokaii, on 19 June 2019 - 08:00 AM, said:

 

There's always that one player and their 'get gud' rhetoric. And yes I do help my team, what you think I do after 14k matches? Just stand there and hope we win? You sure you fully read my opening statement, or are you cherry picking things I've said to fit some sort of narrative you got for me? I do plenty to help my team and am consistently in the top 5. But I can't help the stupid things that cause you to lose in this game. My question was, despite all this, why is my wins over losses remaining the same. I consistently do good, and I in fact do the things that have an 'unsung hero' theme to them. My damage given/taken ratio is low because for the longest time, I only played heavy, ever. It's only been in this passed year or two that I have really branched out to other classes. So if anyone needs to help who out more in my case, are my teams.

 

View PostJunokaii, on 19 June 2019 - 08:06 AM, said:

 

Well, I'd like to believe that the reason I'm not consistently improving is that, but to be honest I'm not convinced. It's very very odd how it has remained at 446 more wins than losses for months give or take a few. And consistently my stats crash whenever I go above that. Did you not read my initial post? I said that as an example, a few days ago I got my stats above 460 for the first time in a long time, then proceeded to lose 11 matches in a row. I failed to mention that over the next 20 or so I basically went on a 'win one, lose two-five'. Then it'll proceed to put me on a winning trend back to 446, then proceeds to stay there. That's basically what's going on. To be honest, I've come to the conclusion that winning isn't really up to us. We can do things that can help to try influence that, but I don't think it's up to us. If it were, I'd never lose a match when I have 3+ kills ever. It's not hard at all for my teams to put effort in when I've killed a third of the enemy team and have twice the damage as the person in second place, but still proceed to lose in this case sometimes. Like I said above too, sometimes I get a match and it's over before I have a chance to really do much because my team for once is that good. There's lots of circumstances beyond our control in this game.

 

Deciding that ONLY YOU own your win rate, and admitting that you can still improve A LOT MORE than you already have are the first steps you need to take to achieve your goal. 

 

Everyone gets the same matchmaking.  Everyone gets good teams and bad teams.  Not everyone does what it takes to win though, and "what it takes" can take many forms.  

 

Like you, I'm too concerned with wins.  I'm not really all that great at WOT though, so I rarely grind, I never play stock tanks and I play 90+% of my games at mid tiers (and used to play tier 3/4 too much too) where I know I can influence games even with my arthritic jinky thumbs. I avoid tiers 9 and 10 where I am frequently outclassed.  As a result, I have a lot more wins than losses.  It doesn't mean I'm great at WOT, and no one besides me should even care, but I really prefer seeing the Victory screen.  

 

WOT is not keeping you at 446 more wins than losses...you are.   If you want to change the results, you need to change what you are doing.   You may have a mental block about that 446 game W/L gap, but playing the the ST-I so much is not helping as much as other tanks might.  Are you positive you are consistently up to the challenge of tier 9?  I don't really think I am, which is why I don't play much tier 9 (or X) at all.  There is nothing wrong with that.

 

If you really want to get past that 446 number, just play the T-150 (a great tank btw) constantly until you actually get to 500 more wins than losses.  You like the T-150.  You do well in the T-150.  The T-150 can win a lot of battles and is useful top or bottom tier.  Once you see it can be done, maybe you'll just keep chugging past 600, then 700 then 1K.

 

 



Junokaii #31 Posted 20 June 2019 - 02:47 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostRELIC x, on 19 June 2019 - 07:50 PM, said:

 

 

Deciding that ONLY YOU own your win rate, and admitting that you can still improve A LOT MORE than you already have are the first steps you need to take to achieve your goal. 

 

Everyone gets the same matchmaking.  Everyone gets good teams and bad teams.  Not everyone does what it takes to win though, and "what it takes" can take many forms.  

 

Like you, I'm too concerned with wins.  I'm not really all that great at WOT though, so I rarely grind, I never play stock tanks and I play 90+% of my games at mid tiers (and used to play tier 3/4 too much too) where I know I can influence games even with my arthritic jinky thumbs. I avoid tiers 9 and 10 where I am frequently outclassed.  As a result, I have a lot more wins than losses.  It doesn't mean I'm great at WOT, and no one besides me should even care, but I really prefer seeing the Victory screen.  

 

WOT is not keeping you at 446 more wins than losses...you are.   If you want to change the results, you need to change what you are doing.   You may have a mental block about that 446 game W/L gap, but playing the the ST-I so much is not helping as much as other tanks might.  Are you positive you are consistently up to the challenge of tier 9?  I don't really think I am, which is why I don't play much tier 9 (or X) at all.  There is nothing wrong with that.

 

If you really want to get past that 446 number, just play the T-150 (a great tank btw) constantly until you actually get to 500 more wins than losses.  You like the T-150.  You do well in the T-150.  The T-150 can win a lot of battles and is useful top or bottom tier.  Once you see it can be done, maybe you'll just keep chugging past 600, then 700 then 1K.

 

 

 

View PostRELIC x, on 19 June 2019 - 07:50 PM, said:

 

 

Deciding that ONLY YOU own your win rate, and admitting that you can still improve A LOT MORE than you already have are the first steps you need to take to achieve your goal. 

 

Everyone gets the same matchmaking.  Everyone gets good teams and bad teams.  Not everyone does what it takes to win though, and "what it takes" can take many forms.  

 

Like you, I'm too concerned with wins.  I'm not really all that great at WOT though, so I rarely grind, I never play stock tanks and I play 90+% of my games at mid tiers (and used to play tier 3/4 too much too) where I know I can influence games even with my arthritic jinky thumbs. I avoid tiers 9 and 10 where I am frequently outclassed.  As a result, I have a lot more wins than losses.  It doesn't mean I'm great at WOT, and no one besides me should even care, but I really prefer seeing the Victory screen.  

 

WOT is not keeping you at 446 more wins than losses...you are.   If you want to change the results, you need to change what you are doing.   You may have a mental block about that 446 game W/L gap, but playing the the ST-I so much is not helping as much as other tanks might.  Are you positive you are consistently up to the challenge of tier 9?  I don't really think I am, which is why I don't play much tier 9 (or X) at all.  There is nothing wrong with that.

 

If you really want to get past that 446 number, just play the T-150 (a great tank btw) constantly until you actually get to 500 more wins than losses.  You like the T-150.  You do well in the T-150.  The T-150 can win a lot of battles and is useful top or bottom tier.  Once you see it can be done, maybe you'll just keep chugging past 600, then 700 then 1K.

 

 

 

Funny you say that about the T-150, because for the most part I switched. I hardly ever play my ST-I now, and it's due to the fact that so many tier X tanks are overpowered compared to IX's, can take away half my health and kill my driver or something instantly, but I'd have to shoot them a good 7x before they're dead. It's very unfair. So, I switched to my T-150 cause I noticed I did better with it. My biggest complaint about the T-150 is its aiming speed, feels like you gotta wait an eternity for it to aim. And perhaps a slightly better penetration. I run into tanks like the Absolution, and that thing is cheap as hell I think, does as much damage as me, shoots way quicker, aims way quicker and has slightly better armour and can't pen it sometimes. But overall yeah. Win 57% the game claims, even though it doesn't feel like it :/

Edited by Junokaii, 20 June 2019 - 02:52 PM.


Junokaii #32 Posted 20 June 2019 - 02:55 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostSPUK4U, on 19 June 2019 - 06:23 PM, said:

 

You asked why your win ration stays same and I tried to explain that you have to change things to improve, old ways are not improving your Win rate even if they are clearly still working to keep you in your current level.  Many are fine with old ways that work, but it's clearly annoying you so you need to do something to it, break the old habits.  Try to do new thing, things like don't go into valley in the Lakeville go into town type of new things, avoid old familiar spots in the maps, force yourself to learn new spots. You can also make some research, look battle replays and try to figure out what you could have done better, what were your mistakes, not what were the teammates mistake's, those are easy to find.  So Gid-Gud  or accept your fate.  :teethhappy:

 

No, you basically got nothing but 'get gud'. I'm doing plenty to 'get gud', and I've stated multiple times why at this point. It's just not translating into wins, that's it.

Junokaii #33 Posted 20 June 2019 - 02:58 PM

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 14664 battles
  • 51
  • Member since:
    05-27-2014

View PostSirlceCream, on 19 June 2019 - 04:00 PM, said:

Which winrate do you think you deserve?

 

I dunno. Something closer to what yours is, sound fine?

M4ntiX #34 Posted 20 June 2019 - 04:11 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 30103 battles
  • 4,271
  • [JOCO]
  • Member since:
    03-18-2014

View PostMilitaryGoose05, on 18 June 2019 - 04:18 PM, said:

Remember the game is also 'balanced' so that almost all players will have a WR between 48-52%, so that bad players don't get frustrated and quit.

 

This is the source of all the complaints about rigged MM. Because yes, MM is rigged to keep the bell curve of WR between 48-52, and will manipulate your matches to keep you there if you start doing really well or really badly.

 

So yes, judge your success by other metrics is the answer.

 

Lol. Nonsense. You might want to consider wrapping the tinfoil less tightly, I think it may be reducing the blood flow.

* MY TEAM IS ALWAYS MADE BY MONGOL TRISOMIC STYLE PLAY LIKE NO BRAIN! *

* I live in reality and let me tell you, there is no one here. * For some reason you feel the need to troll stink bomb a statement of fact. *

* 4 kids single father 2 boats a plane 3cars and more battles than you. * Jesus you smegheads are whiny about your Epeens. *


tankmurdoc #35 Posted 20 June 2019 - 05:10 PM

    First lieutenant

  • Players
  • 44643 battles
  • 654
  • Member since:
    10-06-2014

It's a case of simple math. Let's say you have played 40,000 games total, with a win rate of 50% (no draws in this example). Tomorrow, you stumble and hit your head, and suddenly become a dark purple winning 70% of your games for the next 5,000 games. You will now have played 45,000 games but only increased overall win rate by 2.2%. 

 

Obviously, this is not likely to happen. Even if you start winning at a 60% rate you will only increase your overall rate by 1.1%. Once you have a very large number of games played, even if your game improves, the sheer volume will dilute the results. You can start a new account. It will reflect your task current skill level. Good for the ego perhaps, but definitely not good for the wallet.



redshadowrider #36 Posted 20 June 2019 - 11:36 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 37674 battles
  • 8,304
  • Member since:
    03-17-2014

View Posttankmurdoc, on 20 June 2019 - 11:10 AM, said:

It's a case of simple math. Let's say you have played 40,000 games total, with a win rate of 50% (no draws in this example). Tomorrow, you stumble and hit your head, and suddenly become a dark purple winning 70% of your games for the next 5,000 games. You will now have played 45,000 games but only increased overall win rate by 2.2%. 

 

Obviously, this is not likely to happen. Even if you start winning at a 60% rate you will only increase your overall rate by 1.1%. Once you have a very large number of games played, even if your game improves, the sheer volume will dilute the results. You can start a new account. It will reflect your task current skill level. Good for the ego perhaps, but definitely not good for the wallet.

I thought about rerolling because I played over 2k games not knowing about sniper view.  (And I am not the only one.....you already know who you are.).  :trollface:   However, I decided not to since my stats represents all of my performance, not just when I got better.  Then I stopped tracking them altogether.  I try hard, but carrying is a rare occurrence, but that's ok cause I am having fun again.  Even with the problems that the game has.


I'm just saying.....

BigZoomBear #37 Posted 20 June 2019 - 11:50 PM

    First lieutenant

  • Players
  • 52783 battles
  • 835
  • Member since:
    02-22-2014
Choose the type of tank that best fits the way you most enjoy playing.

"It's all about the K/D ratio." - Rommel;  "Winning matters, not WN8" - Churchill;

"MoEs are worthless if your win rate is below 60%" - Montgomery

 

Medals: 3 Pools, 6 Oskins, 12 Orliks, 33 Radley-Walters, 69 Kolobanovs, 93 Devastators, 1437 Top Guns. Survivor: 41 battles.


RAGNAR0K N ROLL #38 Posted 21 June 2019 - 02:27 AM

    Major

  • Beta Tester
  • 19509 battles
  • 11,055
  • [JOCO]
  • Member since:
    06-29-2013
I have an abysmal survival rate which means I bite off more than I can chew often but my win rate has stayed at around 53% for a looong time

The Warrior of The Wasteland...The Ayatollah of Rock N' Rolla....

 


Will-E-WangStar #39 Posted 21 June 2019 - 04:02 AM

    Major

  • Players
  • 36485 battles
  • 3,443
  • [XRM]
  • Member since:
    01-20-2016

View PostJunokaii, on 17 June 2019 - 03:33 PM, said:

 

Limit? Why there a limit?

 

because you have to keep getring better at the game. And as your skill level grows your carrying ability also grow and thus are you more able to make near certain losses into wins....

also platoning with better players then tourself will help your winrate grow a little bit more


Formally known as: BoereJack

 My Youtube Channel Filled With WOT PS4 Gameplay: https://www.youtube....FnoS605ne-GYwiA

3 MARKED TANKS:

SNAKEBITE, T21, SP1C, LYCAN, T-54 LWT, T-54

 


John-berg1995 #40 Posted 21 June 2019 - 03:06 PM

    Major

  • Players
  • 12684 battles
  • 2,918
  • [CIA]
  • Member since:
    12-05-2015

View PostMedgar20, on 17 June 2019 - 04:21 PM, said:

Decent K/D, DC/R and reasonably survival % but lower winrate often means someone is playing too passively in the early game, which takes the result away from their control. Looking at your most played tank (ST-I) and comparing to mine you got around 41% survival which is pretty close to mine (45%) but 1.63k damage per game to my 2.27k and 10% less win rate. Some of that is due to luck no doubt, particularly since I only have~150 games in mine so my true win rate is probably lower but overall that would point to too many games where you aren't on the front line quick enough to do the damage early and swing the match your way. Recording games etc would obv help to know if there's something else though :)

I play pretty passively to, probably why I can't seem to break out of 61% haha







Also tagged with wins, losses, stats, draws

1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users