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I love the consistent damage rolls!

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Poll: Reduced RNG (72 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 50 battles in order to participate this poll.

Do you like the reduced damage "RNG?"

  1. Yes (51 votes [70.83%])

    Percentage of vote: 70.83%

  2. No (21 votes [29.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 29.17%

Do you like the removed penetration "RNG?"

  1. No (41 votes [56.94%])

    Percentage of vote: 56.94%

  2. Yes (31 votes [43.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 43.06%

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XLilabnerX #21 Posted 08 August 2019 - 08:37 PM

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View Postwestmech, on 08 August 2019 - 12:49 PM, said:

I have really enjoyed the event so far. The Machine is insanely OP right now. The standard rounds pierce without a problem and having consistent damage rolls above 300 makes this thing even more the juggernaut it already has been. HEAT is hole puncher it you want it to be, and I find the modules are getting damaged a lot more often than not. I haven't rolled with any TDs or Arty for this event. I would like to hear how they have fared with it though.

 

huh I just emptied a clip into wz111-5a, as I did a drive by along his side at 64 meters. From front to back every shot bounced, from front track curtain, inside hull behind curtain, to side armor where ammo is, lastly back above and beside what looks like tail pipe.

XT356 #22 Posted 08 August 2019 - 09:59 PM

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This event neutered the hesh barn. 1700 max is no bueno.
“Greatness is a transitory experience. It is never consistent. It depends in part upon the myth-making imagination of humankind. The person who experiences greatness must have a feeling for the myth he is in. He must reflect what is projected upon him. And he must have a strong sense of the sardonic. This is what uncouples him from belief in his own pretensions. The sardonic is all that permits him to move within himself. Without this quality, even occasional greatness will destroy a man.”

ThermalStone #23 Posted 08 August 2019 - 10:12 PM

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Hate it.  Skill in WoT is shooting as many times as possible.  Even if your shots aren't perfect, enough will go through.  If you are skilled enough not to take damage in return, you can keep shooting until you run out of ammo or targets or the game ends.  With less possible pen, I'm bouncing a lot more shots unless I spam premium shells.  

 

Also, I realize that it's just my own small sample size, but I'm seeing a lot more "mercy rolls" without the possibility of higher damage rolls.  I think that where before it was possible to kill a hypothetical tank in three lucky shots, now it always takes four.


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TocFanKe4 #24 Posted 08 August 2019 - 10:50 PM

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Armor just seems more powerful.  Before if you shot a tank with 200 armor with a gun that has 198 pen, you had almost a 50/50 chance to pen.  Now there's a zero chance.  I get so many more bounces.  I ground the IS-2 last night, and that thing was bouncing a lot more shots. 

 

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Pit Friend #25 Posted 08 August 2019 - 11:18 PM

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I agree with the others, I like the reduction of RNG for damage and I wish they just used the same reduction to 10% for penetration instead of going to 0. 

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f1mitku #26 Posted 08 August 2019 - 11:38 PM

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Pen and Dmg RNG change is barely noticeable in my view. If I didn’t know about it from the news and the forum - I wouldn’t notice it at all. But I think it’s still better than before because in theory there is lower opportunity for rigging games to screw up the players with that lower RNG even only for the pen and dmg. So I would say - I like it despite its insignificant outcome. 

I would wanna test a changed for better accuracy dispersion formula and its RNG. 


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GEToff MyLawn52 #27 Posted 09 August 2019 - 01:40 AM

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Definitely a fan of the reduced RNG for damage but not so much for the penetration.



Tempest fox3 #28 Posted 09 August 2019 - 04:30 AM

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I selected yes and no for the reduced damage RNG. I'm indifferent about damage RNG as it really doesn't affect me. Sure we all have those 'ugh low roll' moments but we also have those sweet high rolls that save your [edited].

Penetration RNG's complete removal however was a poor choice imo. Tweaking it would have been fine but completely removing it? Not so much.

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FusionStar287 #29 Posted 09 August 2019 - 04:32 AM

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View PostTempest fox3, on 08 August 2019 - 11:30 PM, said:

I selected yes and no for the reduced damage RNG. I'm indifferent about damage RNG as it really doesn't affect me. Sure we all have those 'ugh low roll' moments but we also have those sweet high rolls that save your [edited].

Penetration RNG's complete removal however was a poor choice imo. Tweaking it would have been fine but completely removing it? Not so much.

^This exactly.


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M4ntiX #30 Posted 09 August 2019 - 07:13 AM

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View PostTempest fox3, on 09 August 2019 - 04:30 AM, said:

I selected yes and no for the reduced damage RNG. I'm indifferent about damage RNG as it really doesn't affect me. Sure we all have those 'ugh low roll' moments but we also have those sweet high rolls that save your [edited].

Penetration RNG's complete removal however was a poor choice imo. Tweaking it would have been fine but completely removing it? Not so much.

 

I'm surprised you're saying this. Benefits of more consistent damage rolls are undeniable. It's been only 3 days since damage rolls were reduced to 10% deviation, but I'm loving every minute of it. The fact I don't have to worry I won't be able to kill an enemy on 400 health with my 490 alpha gun is fantastic. The constant and consistent damage output is really satisfying, especially in auto-loaders.

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FusionStar287 #31 Posted 09 August 2019 - 07:28 AM

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View PostM4ntiX, on 09 August 2019 - 02:13 AM, said:

 

I'm surprised you're saying this. Benefits of more consistent damage rolls are undeniable. It's been only 3 days since damage rolls were reduced to 10% deviation, but I'm loving every minute of it. The fact I don't have to worry I won't be able to kill an enemy on 400 health with my 490 alpha gun is fantastic. The constant and consistent damage output is really satisfying, especially in auto-loaders.

Of course, the detriments are just as undeniable. Sure, with a smaller damage roll spread your 400 average damage won't fail to destroy a tank with 350 health and is more likely to knock out a tank with 380 health, but likewise you're less likely to knock out a tank with 420 health and you can't destroy a tank with 450 health at all. The damage RNG change simply reduces both risk and reward, and I personally slightly prefer having the opportunity to reap bigger rewards than having more consistency (of course, I'm still mostly neutral on the change).


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M4ntiX #32 Posted 09 August 2019 - 07:47 AM

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View PostFusionStar287, on 09 August 2019 - 07:28 AM, said:

Of course, the detriments are just as undeniable. Sure, with a smaller damage roll spread your 400 average damage won't fail to destroy a tank with 350 health and is more likely to knock out a tank with 380 health, but likewise you're less likely to knock out a tank with 420 health and you can't destroy a tank with 450 health at all. The damage RNG change simply reduces both risk and reward, and I personally slightly prefer having the opportunity to reap bigger rewards than having more consistency (of course, I'm still mostly neutral on the change).

 

It's the difference of relying on LUCK vs. SKILL, and to an extent you're right. I too like that Casino feeling sometimes. But... I will pick consistency over it every time.

 

With +/-25% damage rolls I MAY get LUCKY and high roll an enemy killing them in one shot. I also may set them on fire, ammo-rack them, etc.

 

With +/-10% I know I WILL kill them in two shots and can plan my approach based on this. I also know I won't roll low emptying my clip in a auto-loader and that's huge as it allows me to engage enemies with a plan that won't get screwed over by RNG (unless I miss, obvs) :D Fortunately "there is no RNG on accuracy/dispersion rolls"... :D


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FusionStar287 #33 Posted 09 August 2019 - 07:59 AM

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View PostM4ntiX, on 09 August 2019 - 02:47 AM, said:

 

It's the difference of relying on LUCK vs. SKILL, and to an extent you're right. I too like that Casino feeling sometimes. But... I will pick consistency over it every time.

 

With +/-25% damage rolls I MAY get LUCKY and high roll an enemy killing them in one shot. I also may set them on fire, ammo-rack them, etc.

 

With +/-10% I know I WILL kill them in two shots and can plan my approach based on this. I also know I won't roll low emptying my clip in a auto-loader and that's huge as it allows me to engage enemies with a plan that won't get screwed over by RNG.

I mean, +10/-10% is barely more skill based than +25/-25%. If I run across a 430 heath enemy in the Chieftain then I'm assuming that I'll need to hit him twice regardless of which RNG spread is in place, and I prefer the normal damage RNG percentages for the sake that you're generally rewarded more for preparing for the worst.


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scwirpeo #34 Posted 09 August 2019 - 10:37 AM

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I can say one thing. Tier ten Arty AP is actually broken now.

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Pit Friend #35 Posted 09 August 2019 - 12:38 PM

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View Postscwirpeo, on 09 August 2019 - 05:37 AM, said:

I can say one thing. Tier ten Arty AP is actually broken now.

 

So it’ll be getting buffed in the next balance pass. Good to know. 

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scwirpeo #36 Posted 09 August 2019 - 01:20 PM

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View PostPit Friend, on 09 August 2019 - 05:38 AM, said:

 

So it’ll be getting buffed in the next balance pass. Good to know. 

 

Destroyer went through the UFP of an IS-7 today. I penned the front of a 215B turret for 1800 damage. I don't know what's more broken. The guarantee of 370 pen or the almost guaranteed 1800 damage.

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Destraag #37 Posted 09 August 2019 - 04:16 PM

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I question what they are actually testing with this mod. Are they gauging the impact of the change, how the community will react to the change or just trying to show the community to be careful what you wish for ...etc. I thought surely thats a joke when I saw the news article... if they are serious about considering making this permanent then I disagree with most of the posts I've seen on the topic.

 

Three points

 

  1. I feel like instead of going to lower rng we should be moving to a normal distribution model like what is used for accuracy. That way the bulk of damage/pen may fall within a +-15% window for example while outliers of +-25% are still possible but less frequent. 
  2. I feel like this should be something players can customize with equipment or supplies or a whole new section of "barrel mods". Some players want more consistent damage results while some players like the possibility for the bigger booms. 
    1. for example some barrel mod that makes it work like current +-25% flat rng while another makes it a tighter bell curve with +-10% for 90% of the shots.
  3.  If we continue to pursue a 0 rng for pen I feel like damage dampening when within the +-25% range (pen vs armor) should be considered. This allows defensive play to still be relevent even if you have only average armor for your tier and would allow slow chipping away at those with only slightly above average armor per tier. I believe this would result in an even flow of damage roughly equal to what you would do on average with the +-25% rng consistently hitting the same armor rather than the armor either works or doesnt model we have now with no rng pen.
    1. some examples to illustrate
      1. shot hits with less than 75 pen against 99~100 armor... no damage/bounce etc - 0%

      2. shot hits 83 pen against 99~100 armor... reduce to 25% damage

      3. shot hits 100 pen against 99~100 armor... reduce to 50% damage

      4. shot hits 112 pen against 99~100 armor... reduce to 75% damage

      5. shot hits 125 pen or higher against 99~100 armor... full damage - 100%

    2. anything below the effective armor by 25% is no damage anything above 25% is full but the middle ground is ratio based.

​​​

suggestion thread I posted on the topic - http://forum-console...test-lower-rng/

 

 


Edited by Destraag, 09 August 2019 - 04:18 PM.

When a person resorts to attacking the other person rather than focusing on the issue (aka argumentum ad hominem), it becomes pretty clear they have nothing else to contribute and are wrong.


M4ntiX #38 Posted 09 August 2019 - 05:56 PM

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View PostDestraag, on 09 August 2019 - 04:16 PM, said:

(...) for example some barrel mod that makes it work like current +-25% flat rng while another makes it a tighter bell curve with +-10% for 90% of the shots.

 

Now, here is an idea that I really like, kind of. Don't we already have it in-game in the form of GLD and Vert Stabs equipment? I know neither makes your gun more accurate, per se, but they do aid accuracy by removing some of the aim penalties. Snap Shot, Smooth Ride, BIA, food, etc... those skills will directly affect your accuracy. If there was a way of picking either better accuracy or more consistent damage rolls, who in their right mind would ever pick the consistent damage. I mean, what is it good for if you can't hit your targets in the first place? :)

 

Anyways, I am also wondering what WG is testing exactly and why are they doing it now, well into 5 years since the game was released. One thing that comes to mind is they're testing core parameters for their next game. At least that's what I want to believe. Who wouldn't like to see a proper release of Tanks 2.0, right? You know, perfectly balanced, well scripted, beautifully modeled, large open maps, 30 vs. 30 grand battles, etc...  (btw, thanks Xbox 360 for keeping us in the previous decade of game development) :)


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