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Most important person in the Allied victory?


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Crazedtiger77 #1 Posted 01 May 2015 - 09:51 PM

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Being as we're approaching VE day, I thought it would be interesting to discuss which military person was the most important in the eventual Allied victory in Europe in 1945. I'll share my thoughts later, but who do you think was the most vital?

Edited by Crazedtiger77, 02 May 2015 - 06:18 AM.


leova #2 Posted 01 May 2015 - 10:34 PM

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I kinda feel like a jerkbag saying this, because I'm Russian AND Jewish....but honestly, Hitler had more to do with the Allied Victory and any other single person on either side of the War

 

His stubbornness, ego, greed, unparalleled racism, and unbelievable evil led him to fail horrendously when he overreached.

 

As they say in Star Wars,

"The more you tighten your grip, the more systems will slip through your fingers."



monkeyCOWman #3 Posted 01 May 2015 - 11:06 PM

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View Postleova, on 01 May 2015 - 04:34 PM, said:

I kinda feel like a jerkbag saying this, because I'm Russian AND Jewish....but honestly, Hitler had more to do with the Allied Victory and any other single person on either side of the War

 

His stubbornness, ego, greed, unparalleled racism, and unbelievable evil led him to fail horrendously when he overreached.

 

As they say in Star Wars,

"The more you tighten your grip, the more systems will slip through your fingers."

 

Honestly, this is true. Which is why every single what if threat about Germany winning the war is just simply imagination. And just to play the what if game, and make Hitler not go more bat crap crazy then he already was, time would have made Germany lose the war anyway.

 


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I3iggus Nickus #4 Posted 01 May 2015 - 11:09 PM

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I also agree that hitler was one ofbthe biggest reasons that the allies one. Good thing for us too

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leova #5 Posted 01 May 2015 - 11:19 PM

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imagine all the "super weapon" funding gets redirected to instead pump out more Tigers

 

imagine all the troops on the Eastern Front instead sitting in France, waiting for the Americans to come ashore

 

its ridiculous to think, but we could be living in a VERY different world if it was Allies - vs Germany+USSR....



RUNNINGDUDE1 #6 Posted 01 May 2015 - 11:31 PM

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View Postleova, on 01 May 2015 - 03:19 PM, said:

imagine all the "super weapon" funding gets redirected to instead pump out more Tigers

 

imagine all the troops on the Eastern Front instead sitting in France, waiting for the Americans to come ashore

 

its ridiculous to think, but we could be living in a VERY different world if it was Allies - vs Germany+USSR....

 

Don't forget having the feared ME-262 being turned into a fighter bomber instead of being a bomber attacker it was supposed to be.

DieHardELOFan86 #7 Posted 02 May 2015 - 12:06 AM

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Most important person in the Allied victory...


 

I don't agree with title or say who was best but I can say this who was most aggressive General and Admiral from U.S. Military.


 

Simply put General George S. Patton and Admiral Chester Nimitz.


 


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Matthew J35U5 #8 Posted 02 May 2015 - 03:06 AM

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Not a very meaningful question. Say, Churchill/FDR/Stalin. Is it really meaningful to describe any of them as being instrumental in the allied victory? Or if someone wants to say, Eisenhower... But then that completely leaves out the Russian front. 

Think I'll just leave it as, "not very meaningful". 

KeystoneCops, on 14 June 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:


ChopperGreg VGC #9 Posted 02 May 2015 - 03:54 AM

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I pose this question then.

 

If Hitler was the most important person in the Allied victory, what does that say about the likes of Neville Chamberlain, who had the chance to severely hamper Hitler, before he ever really got WW2 started, when Gremany was still comparatively weak?

 

..... Or for that matter, the leaders of the nations that so severely penalizes post WW1 Gremany, that enough of it's citizens would vote to bring Hitler to power, simply because he offered them hope?

 

..... Or even Archduke Ferdinand, who started WW1, because he had to go touring in an area, that was known for generating assassination attempts on Austrian officials, for the preceding 5 years?



Crazedtiger77 #10 Posted 02 May 2015 - 06:30 AM

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View PostChopperGreg VGC, on 02 May 2015 - 03:54 AM, said:

I pose this question then.

 

If Hitler was the most important person in the Allied victory, what does that say about the likes of Neville Chamberlain, who had the chance to severely hamper Hitler, before he ever really got WW2 started, when Germany was still comparatively weak?

 

..... Or for that matter, the leaders of the nations that so severely penalizes post WW1 Gremany, that enough of it's citizens would vote to bring Hitler to power, simply because he offered them hope?

 

..... Or even Archduke Ferdinand, who started WW1, because he had to go touring in an area, that was known for generating assassination attempts on Austrian officials, for the preceding 5 years?

 

Chamberlain gets a pretty bad deal when it comes to the history books - he couldn't drag Britain into a war which the people didn't want (mind you, what the Munich Agreement did to Czechoslovakia was downright backstabbing) but I don't think he had any choice regarding whether to appease or attack Hitler.

 

It was really Clemeanceau who made the Treaty of Versailles so harsh, which was justified after what had happened to his country. 

 

However, Ferdinand was stirring something up with those tours, so it was either incredibly poorly planned or stupid.



Panthergraf #11 Posted 02 May 2015 - 03:52 PM

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The guys at Bletchley Park decoding Enigma.

ChopperGreg VGC #12 Posted 02 May 2015 - 03:58 PM

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View PostCrazedtiger77, on 01 May 2015 - 11:30 PM, said:

 

Chamberlain gets a pretty bad deal when it comes to the history books - he couldn't drag Britain into a war which the people didn't want (mind you, what the Munich Agreement did to Czechoslovakia was downright backstabbing) but I don't think he had any choice regarding whether to appease or attack Hitler.

 

It was really Clemeanceau who made the Treaty of Versailles so harsh, which was justified after what had happened to his country. 

 

However, Ferdinand was stirring something up with those tours, so it was either incredibly poorly planned or stupid.

 

The agreement was backstabbing.  I can sympathize with not wanting to get into a fight, but sometimes you have to bloody your knuckles, in order to keep the knives from being pulled.  Quite simply it was a matter of putting a bully in his place, before his successes , lead him to believe that there was nothing he couldn't do.

 

The French may have had some justification, but the Brits were in on it too.  Sure there should have been a penalty, but if the sentence is to harsh all it does is breed resentment.  Near as I understand things, the German Navy was annoyed that the Army, was the brokers of the original deal, and didn't like the idea of just turning their ships over.  So they revolted, and went on a rampage just when the fighting was dying down, and that really pissed the French and Brits off, so the penalties were made much harsher.

 



SolidGoldCrown #13 Posted 02 May 2015 - 04:02 PM

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The most vital person to allied success in WWII would be my father. He shined at doing his part with Darby's Rangers at Anzio until losing a leg made it too difficult to continue.

I'm pretty sure there were a few others like him.


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FlukenJager #14 Posted 02 May 2015 - 05:23 PM

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1) hitler wasn't that crazy…he was sick…. google the final stages of syphilis, he caught it during WW I as a corporal.

 

2) what if scenarios aren't that far fetched, there have been several well researched books written on it, the 'what if scenarios' came REAL close to actually happening especially since MOST of the technological advances of the 20th century made by russians and the US were scavenged/stolen from germany during the early occupation.

 

3) german generals complaining "hitler got in my way or I would have'…." is a pile… you can always say i could would shouldda and my idea would have worked when it's all said and done. Germany wouldn't even have BEEN in the position TO fail without Hitler, Himler, Gudarian and a select few.

 

it is difficult to pinpoint a single most pivotal person for the success of the ally victory anymore than trying to pinpoint who was the most pivotal in making the 911 attacks succeed.

It was a group effort and many people died making it happen.

 

Some of the people it wouldn't have happened without weren't even in high command…. people like 1st sergeant funk, omar bradley and jumping jim gavin.

 

I think it's pretty clear Montgomery was our hitler, we all would have been in berlin before the battle of the bulge had occurred had we just retired montgomery after africa.



Matthew J35U5 #15 Posted 03 May 2015 - 12:38 AM

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Most of the 20th century's innovations such as:

Were invented by Nazi Germany. (And then stolen after occupation)

Hm. Struggling to fill in the blank there. Anyone want to take a shot?

KeystoneCops, on 14 June 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:


leova #16 Posted 03 May 2015 - 01:20 AM

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I'll say Einstein!

 

and Sauerkraut!



killer etzi0 #17 Posted 03 May 2015 - 01:31 AM

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What if the Japanese had not attacked the USA when they did? The leadership and feeling of the public at the time was to stay out of the conflict. Japan's strike on Pearl Harbor bought America full bore into the conflict.

"When you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat."

 

Ronald Reagan
 

 


Matthew J35U5 #18 Posted 03 May 2015 - 01:39 AM

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View Postkiller etzi0, on 02 May 2015 - 08:31 PM, said:

What if the Japanese had not attacked the USA when they did? The leadership and feeling of the public at the time was to stay out of the conflict. Japan's strike on Pearl Harbor bought America full bore into the conflict.

A Red Europe. 


KeystoneCops, on 14 June 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:


veetwin2 #19 Posted 03 May 2015 - 04:09 AM

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The most important person,...........everyone's Husband, Dad, brother, child etc, that was killed in the conflict 

Meh Havoc #20 Posted 03 May 2015 - 04:52 AM

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